The SEC

[amazinblue]

I watched a bit of football over the weekend, and was wondering if anyone else has come to the same conclusion I have. What I believed, after watching numerous SEC games this weekend and throughout the season, is this - there are two good teams in the SEC - Florida and Alabama - that's it.

No one else looked even close to impressive - either this weekend or throughout the season.

Am I the only person that feels this way?

[MgoMatt]

You are dead on. For the longest time, the media tried to pretend that the SEC is the best conference, top to bottom, but at this point in the season, even the folks on ESPN are admitting that there are only 2 good teams in the SEC.

[Wolvrin704]

There are some solid teams in the SEC outside the top 2 but they all have issues. To be honest the Big 12 is by far the best conference in the country this year and its not even close. Florida and Alabama do stack up to the top teams in the Big 12 and could possibly even beat them. But there is far more depth in that conference.

[GoGreen23]

I agree with what you guys are saying. Many teams in the SEC have been a letdown-Tennesse, Auburn, and LSU just to name a few. Florida has looked amazing as of late, constantly blowing out teams like they are nothing and Alabama has looked decent. Although they might be ranked #1 I still have been more impressed with OU, Texas, and Florida.

You can be sure that I will be watching the Big 12 and the SEC championship games though. Florida and Alabama is a game that should be very fun to watch.

[amazinblue]

I...You can be sure that I will be watching the Big 12 and the SEC championship games though. Florida and Alabama is a game that should be very fun to watch.

GoGreen23,

I'm planning on watching as much of the conference championship games as I can. No doubt the SEC and Big 12 championship games should be great - or fun to watch.

I guess the point I was trying to make, and that I think several agree with is - no conference this year is "really deep" - if you know what I mean. The Big 12 has three good teams - Texas, Texas Tech, and Oklahoma. The SEC has Bama and Florida. After those - the conferences seem to drop very quickly.

I hope that the Big 10 can do well in the bowl season - regardless of who they are lining up against. If the Rose Bowl turns out to be PSU against USC - I do hope that JoePa & Co can pull a rabbit out of their hat.

And, all the people out here talking about how the bowl games are "virtual" home games for a lot of teams - let's look at this objectively for a minute - the distance from USC's campus to Pasadena is about the same as the drive from Ann Arbor to Metro Airport... hmmm.. is it really that close, or far away? And, the drive for LSU from Baton Rouge (even though they aren't Sugar Bowl bound this season) to New Orleans is about the same as driving from Ann Arbor to Battle Creek...

There's a lot of home cooking going on during bowl season. For the Big 10 to get some respect, we just have to win - period - sort of like the old - "anyplace, anytime" for a key game.

[Plus 1]

I watched a bit of football over the weekend, and was wondering if anyone else has come to the same conclusion I have. What I believed, after watching numerous SEC games this weekend and throughout the season, is this - there are two good teams in the SEC - Florida and Alabama - that's it.

No one else looked even close to impressive - either this weekend or throughout the season.

Am I the only person that feels this way?




No you're not the only one.
The SEC is nothing special anymore. Tennessee is awful, Georgia was way overrated {and even lost to an ACC team over the weekend?}, Arkansas sucks, Auburn is lousy, and LSU although they started fast, they fell just as fast, even losing to Troy. Ole Miss was better than most of them, and that isn't saying much. It's the Big 2 and little 10 in the SEC. It wasn't just the SEC beating up on each other either. They also lost their share of non-c games. Nothing Special!:rolleyes:

The Big 12 however is also playing over their head and 1 of the big 2 in the SEC will beat Oklahoma in the NC. Mark it down!!!.:cool:

There are 2 teams that could possibly beat the SEC's best and neither will get the chance, USC & Penn State. JoePa does'nt lose bowl games. Beating Penn State in the post season is like pulling teeth. Just ask Alabama about the last time they tried to beat JoePa out for the NC on the field {and Ala. may have had a better team then, than they do now, at least in PPG .}. JoePa thrives on all that time off to prepare for the post season. Having said that however, it will be tough for PSU to beat USC "at home" in the Rose Bowl.:eek:

[Wolvrin704]

No you're not the only one.
The SEC is nothing special anymore. Tennessee is awful, Georgia was way overrated {and even lost to an ACC team over the weekend?}, Arkansas sucks, Auburn is lousy, and LSU although they started fast, they fell just as fast, even losing to Troy. Ole Miss was better than most of them, and that isn't saying much. It's the Big 2 and little 10 in the SEC. It wasn't just the SEC beating up on each other either. They also lost their share of non-c games. Nothing Special!:rolleyes:

The Big 12 however is also playing over their head and 1 of the big 2 in the SEC will beat Oklahoma in the NC. Mark it down!!!.:cool:

There are 2 teams that could possibly beat the SEC's best and neither will get the chance, USC & Penn State. JoePa does'nt lose bowl games. Beating Penn State in the post season is like pulling teeth. Just ask Alabama about the last time they tried to beat JoePa out for the NC on the field {and Ala. may have had a better team then, than they do now, at least in PPG .}. JoePa thrives on all that time off to prepare for the post season. Having said that however, it will be tough for PSU to beat USC "at home" in the Rose Bowl.:eek:

Not to defend the SEC because I'm certainly no fan but I'm not convinced that they are down that much or their time is over. I think its partly a matter of some of their traditional power houses being down this year(UT, Ark) and some of them having serious issues with their personel (UGA, LSU). Another big factor is that some of the traditional bottom dwellers in the SEC; UK, USC, MSU and Vandy, have become significantly better and can compete with the big boys. And yet one more thought is that Florida and Alabama have just been so much better than everyone this year that the rest of the league have had no shot.
I also agree that whoever comes out of the SEC title game is likely to smoke the B12 contendor. Of course another monkey could still be thrown into the loop here; suppose for a minute that Mizzou beats OK. Texas would be in the NC without winning a conference title or even playing for one.

I would put the favs to win the NC something like this:

1. Florida
2. Oklahoma
3. Alabama
4. Texas
5. USC (they have a very outside shot of still getting in)

[Plus 1]

Not to defend the SEC because I'm certainly no fan but I'm not convinced that they are down that much or their time is over. I think its partly a matter of some of their traditional power houses being down this year(UT, Ark) and some of them having serious issues with their personel (UGA, LSU). Another big factor is that some of the traditional bottom dwellers in the SEC; UK, USC, MSU and Vandy, have become significantly better and can compete with the big boys. And yet one more thought is that Florida and Alabama have just been so much better than everyone this year that the rest of the league have had no shot.
I also agree that whoever comes out of the SEC title game is likely to smoke the B12 contendor. Of course another monkey could still be thrown into the loop here; suppose for a minute that Mizzou beats OK. Texas would be in the NC without winning a conference title or even playing for one.

I would put the favs to win the NC something like this:

1. Florida
2. Oklahoma
3. Alabama
4. Texas
5. USC (they have a very outside shot of still getting in)

The traditional power teams being down is a problem for all conferences at times, ie Michigan, Wisconsin, Illinois etc. But it seems that Tennessee and Auburn have been going down for a couple of years now as well as Arkansas. Alabama has just recently made a resurrgence, after years of mediocrity.

I agree that the bottom dwellers are a little better able to contend but not with he big 2.
{Kentucky & South Carolina are down from last year} {Vandy & Ole Miss are up} It seems to be a little of the middle sagging and the bottom rising up.
That still does'nt explain the total collapse of Tennessee & Auburn. Also the bottom SEC teams getting a little better does not explain the losses by Georgia {Preseason #1} losing to a non-c GT of the mediocre ACC, and LSU losing to Troy!???
If there are off the field issues in the SEC then let em join the rest of the country. That's all part and parcel of fielding great teams, is being able to overcome the off field problems and play the guys that want to do it right. If it's injuries then again that's unfortunatly part of it too. Great teams and conferences have deep depth charts.

I think we are just seeing the SEC as a whole coming down off of a 2 year high 06 & 07 when they were so outstanding as an overall conference that they look worse now overall by comparison to those 2 years.

I've watched all of the big conferences do this for many years. When you're on top it's great, but if there's anything harder than getting on top, It's staying on top!

People come to expect you to keep it up but it's hard, and it gets harder. The more you win the harder it is to keep winning. The more the media brags on your conf. the tougher it gets to keep winning. To whom much is given much is expected.
Every year from now on the SEC is going to be held to a higher standard and expectations will get ever higher and they must keep it up, and they will be under more and more pressure to keep it up. That's a heavy load to put on a bunch of kids. All the big confernces have been there, done that. I've seen it many times.

Independant Notre Dame was there too.:(

The SEC teams have a long way to go to catch up with Notre Dame's accomplishments, but look where ND is now.

I of course agree with your 5 team list but only because Oklahoma is out of place. Texas should be in the Big 12 C Game and not have to go to the NC without winning the conference. {not depending on Missouri at all. Texas should be #2 right now.} I also truly believe that Texas or USC would make a better opponent for the winner of the SEC title in the 08 NC. I'd rather see Penn State play the SEC in the Title game than OKlahoma. JoePa is hard to beat in the post season.:)

[bluefan]

Again: LSU beat Troy.

[Plus 1]

Again: LSU beat Troy.

Bluefool

That's twice now that LSU beat Troy, and in only 1 season!!! Very good. Again I stand corrected by GREATNESS.
I don't know how I could have let that 31-3 Troy lead late in the 3rd quarter fool me. Troy must have went home in the 4th quarter.:eek:

Thank you Mr. Wonderful!!!!!!!!! Oh, you know how it is sometimes we don't catch the late scores or look them up. By the way, what was the OSU/Michigan score???:D
BTW: In case you don't recognize it, this is sarcasm!!!:rolleyes:

[GoGreen23]

The traditional power teams being down is a problem for all conferences at times, ie Michigan, Wisconsin, Illinois etc.

I don't know if I'd classify Illinois as a tradition power school in the Big Ten. But that's just me.

[GoDeepHammer]

I don't know if I'd classify Illinois as a tradition power school in the Big Ten. But that's just me.

So, which ones are you calling traditional power teams?

[Wolvrin704]

Bluefool

That's twice now that LSU beat Troy, and in only 1 season!!! Very good. Again I stand corrected by GREATNESS.
I don't know how I could have let that 31-3 Troy lead late in the 3rd quarter fool me. Troy must have went home in the 4th quarter.:eek:

Thank you Mr. Wonderful!!!!!!!!! Oh, you know how it is sometimes we don't catch the late scores or look them up. By the way, what was the OSU/Michigan score???:D
BTW: In case you don't recognize it, this is sarcasm!!!:rolleyes:

Someone sure got up on the cranky side of the bed today. Go take your Ensure and go play some checkers or whatever you play at the retirement home.

[bluefan]

Hey, that's just his way of showing his Christianity. He is surely a beacon of goodwill and a model example to all non-Christians everywhere. I can't fathom why anyone wouldn't want to be a Christian. Look at S uck 1 and how he is adored by everyone.

[GoGreen23]

So, which ones are you calling traditional power teams?

Michigan and Ohio State are the only two traditionally top teams in the conference year after year. The rest of the teams all have had their ups and downs and I'm not including Penn State in the discussion because they didn't join the conference until the mid 90's.

Illinois has won something like 15 Big Ten titles but they were mostly in the 30's and before, over half of them. Minnesota has 18 over about the same span Illinois does but I would hardly call them "Traditional Powers." To me, the is reserved for teams that consistently win the title and are usually considered the "face" of the conference. I think OSU and Michigan fit that description, but not Illinois.

[gator]

Just some thoughts on the SEC from an SEC fan...in case anyone is interested. There are a lot of good thoughts here, but I tend to agree mostly with Wolvrin704. I think the perception has been mostly damaged by a few of the power houses and that performance by UGA versus GT. The dropoff from AUB, LSU, and TENN this year removed about half of the SEC teams traditionally ranked in the top25. UGA lost to the highest ranked ACC team in a close game, but it still took some shine off the SEC because UGA was overrated at #1 at the beginning of the season. Yes, the perception of the SEC took a hit this year, and rightfully so. Top to bottom the Big12 may very well be the best conference this year although I still have some reservations based on the defensive performances I see in that conference every week. Regardless, I wouldn't get to carried away knocking the SEC just yet.

Overall, three traditionally ranked SEC teams fell from the top25, two of which are usually near the top 10 (LSU and AUB), and four SEC teams are still ranked (ALA, FLA, UGA, Ole Miss) with two of them still in NC contention. Not bad! Honestly, what other conferences could pull off something like that? The Big12 maybe. If Penn St, UM, and MSU all fell from the top25, would the Big10 still have 4 ranked teams with two title contenders? The Pac10, ACC, and BigEast wouldn't stand a chance.

I think Ole Miss is a really amazing story; I'm actually suprised that nobody here thinks they're a good team. Arkansas suffered from a similar fate as UM this year: coaching philosophy/player talent contrast. However, they still play good D, discovered a good running back, were much improved by season's end, and will have Mallett at their disposal next year. Alabama is going to return to national prominence, mark it down. LSU could be headed for down times in my opinion because Les Miles is an idiot. Honestly, he makes some of the worst coaching decisions I've ever seen. He doesn't have Polini and they still didn't discover a QB this year. However he could prove me wrong and get them right back on top; it's not like LSU is hurting for talent. Heck, they just came off of 3 straight 10 win seasons. AUB is a difficult call because Tommy T resigned. It really hinges on the next coach because they still have a great D. I wonder if Muskchamp (sp?) will return even though he's now the HC in waiting at Texas. UGA will probably remain were they are - just short of elite, but a consistent top15 team. FLA will be a contender as long as Meyer is here. Tenn is a 50/50 deal; they have a lot of tradition and the ability to recruit. IMO, it all depends on the coaching staff Kiffin puts togeter. I have to think he learned a thing or two from Pete Carroll. SC has hoovered near the top 25 the past couple years despite no offense. Who thinks that will continue if Spurrier ever lands a QB and a couple of WR's. You have to remember that this is a conference studded with talent and coaching. Consider that if ALA beats FLA and goes on to win the NC, the SEC will have 3 straight NC's by 3 different teams. Has any other conference ever had a shot at something like that this late in the season. If FLA wins out it will still be 3 straight NC's with two teams. If this is "hard times" for the SEC, I think can handle it.

[amazinblue]

Just some thoughts on the SEC from an SEC fan...in case anyone is interested. There are a lot of good thoughts here, but I tend to agree mostly with Wolvrin704. I think the perception has been mostly damaged by a few of the power houses and that performance by UGA versus GT. The dropoff from AUB, LSU, and TENN this year removed about half of the SEC teams traditionally ranked in the top25. UGA lost to the highest ranked ACC team in a close game, but it still took some shine off the SEC because UGA was overrated at #1 at the beginning of the season. Yes, the perception of the SEC took a hit this year, and rightfully so. Top to bottom the Big12 may very well be the best conference this year although I still have some reservations based on the defensive performances I see in that conference every week. Regardless, I wouldn't get to carried away knocking the SEC just yet.

Overall, three traditionally ranked SEC teams fell from the top25, two of which are usually near the top 10 (LSU and AUB), and four SEC teams are still ranked (ALA, FLA, UGA, Ole Miss) with two of them still in NC contention. Not bad! Honestly, what other conferences could pull off something like that? The Big12 maybe. If Penn St, UM, and MSU all fell from the top25, would the Big10 still have 4 ranked teams with two title contenders? The Pac10, ACC, and BigEast wouldn't stand a chance.

I think Ole Miss is a really amazing story; I'm actually suprised that nobody here thinks they're a good team. Arkansas suffered from a similar fate as UM this year: coaching philosophy/player talent contrast. However, they still play good D, discovered a good running back, were much improved by season's end, and will have Mallett at their disposal next year. Alabama is going to return to national prominence, mark it down. LSU could be headed for down times in my opinion because Les Miles is an idiot. Honestly, he makes some of the worst coaching decisions I've ever seen. He doesn't have Polini and they still didn't discover a QB this year. However he could prove me wrong and get them right back on top; it's not like LSU is hurting for talent. Heck, they just came off of 3 straight 10 win seasons. AUB is a difficult call because Tommy T resigned. It really hinges on the next coach because they still have a great D. I wonder if Muskchamp (sp?) will return even though he's now the HC in waiting at Texas. UGA will probably remain were they are - just short of elite, but a consistent top15 team. FLA will be a contender as long as Meyer is here. Tenn is a 50/50 deal; they have a lot of tradition and the ability to recruit. IMO, it all depends on the coaching staff Kiffin puts togeter. I have to think he learned a thing or two from Pete Carroll. SC has hoovered near the top 25 the past couple years despite no offense. Who thinks that will continue if Spurrier ever lands a QB and a couple of WR's. You have to remember that this is a conference studded with talent and coaching. Consider that if ALA beats FLA and goes on to win the NC, the SEC will have 3 straight NC's by 3 different teams. Has any other conference ever had a shot at something like that this late in the season. If FLA wins out it will still be 3 straight NC's with two teams. If this is "hard times" for the SEC, I think can handle it.


Gator,

I like your perspectives on things, and think you're one of the posters here who understands college football. So, I do believe that Ole Miss is a solid team, and I do believe that this season the SEC "top to bottom" is not as strong as it has been in other years. And, for those programs that are struggling, TN, Auburn, GA, LSU - I do believe most of them will play stronger next season - realizing that Florida and Bama are young and with their coaches are going to the be respective teams you've got to "go through" in order to win your division.

What I can't stand, is the "media darling" attitude toward the SEC. And, to be fair, it's probably not the result of anything the teams are doing - but, a reluctance by the media to question certain things. For example, Florida loses by one to Ole Miss at home, USC lost 27-21 to a decent Oregon State team on the road - and it seems that everyone says - "The SEC is strong, the Pac 10 is weak" - and, that's it. IMO, that's just BS.

The lack of solid OOC scheduling - particularly at the top, turns the NCAA into a beauty contest, and that's really what I abhor. I do believe that several teams are "very good" this season - Florida's the cream of the crop in the SEC, USC is it in the Pac 10, PSU from the Big 10. The Big 12 - hell, I can't figure that one out - but, it's Texas or Oklahoma.

I don't care for a "selection process" that could easily be compared to a national "Miss USA" beauty pageant. And, the media, throughout time - have fallen in love with certain teams - certainly USC's a pre-season media darling most every season (over the last six), and what Urban Meyer's doing in Florida will make them the same for seasons to come. I just wish the media was more objective - and not reluctant to state a case for USC or PSU this season - apparently, the sports media just doesn't have the balls I'd hope they would.

So, though it might seem like I'm dogging the SEC, I'm really not (maybe some of their fans). I think there are more than two "deserving" teams to play for a college football national championship.

[gator]

Gator,

I like your perspectives on things, and think you're one of the posters here who understands college football. So, I do believe that Ole Miss is a solid team, and I do believe that this season the SEC "top to bottom" is not as strong as it has been in other years. And, for those programs that are struggling, TN, Auburn, GA, LSU - I do believe most of them will play stronger next season - realizing that Florida and Bama are young and with their coaches are going to the be respective teams you've got to "go through" in order to win your division.

What I can't stand, is the "media darling" attitude toward the SEC. And, to be fair, it's probably not the result of anything the teams are doing - but, a reluctance by the media to question certain things. For example, Florida loses by one to Ole Miss at home, USC lost 27-21 to a decent Oregon State team on the road - and it seems that everyone says - "The SEC is strong, the Pac 10 is weak" - and, that's it. IMO, that's just BS.

The lack of solid OOC scheduling - particularly at the top, turns the NCAA into a beauty contest, and that's really what I abhor. I do believe that several teams are "very good" this season - Florida's the cream of the crop in the SEC, USC is it in the Pac 10, PSU from the Big 10. The Big 12 - hell, I can't figure that one out - but, it's Texas or Oklahoma.

I don't care for a "selection process" that could easily be compared to a national "Miss USA" beauty pageant. And, the media, throughout time - have fallen in love with certain teams - certainly USC's a pre-season media darling most every season (over the last six), and what Urban Meyer's doing in Florida will make them the same for seasons to come. I just wish the media was more objective - and not reluctant to state a case for USC or PSU this season - apparently, the sports media just doesn't have the balls I'd hope they would.

So, though it might seem like I'm dogging the SEC, I'm really not (maybe some of their fans). I think there are more than two "deserving" teams to play for a college football national championship.

Thanks for the vote of confidence - I try to keep it real. I totally get your point on media bias. I guess it's one of two things: you're either built up or torn down by the media; they are never neutral. When the media loves you, you have two things working against you: 1) your conference's teams hear how great they are and think they can role out their jerseys and 2) teams from other conferences absolutely hate your guts and play tougher for it. I must remind you that even the SEC isn't immune to the disdain of the media, lest I remind you of the 2006 season. From our perspective, the SEC couldn't buy a vote of confidence. The SEC hadn't made a BCSNC appearance since 2003 and that one was disputed by USC. In 2006, we stomached talk about the game of the century (UM/OSU) for a month followed by non-stop centiment to rematch UM and OSU in the NC game. It was a lovefest, every bit as sickening as the one you are currently experiencing. I remember MUSHberger, Herbie, and Bob Davie commenting during the UM/OSU game that it didn't matter what happened in a month, this was the NC in their opinion. I even got it on tape so I can relive the moment and relish in their ignorance. The SEC just wanted a chance to prove it on the field. If OSU had won the last two NC games, we would have never heard the end of it. We would be the ones biatching about media bias, and maybe none of you would believe us. For the record, I am well aware of the media bias and I dispise it even when it is in our favor.

When the media hates you, it just sucks. Oh...that team just couldn't hang with those guys, they're clearly the best two teams in the country. Do you remember the 2004 season? Other than Auburn fans, nobody batted an eye about undefeated Auburn being left out of the NC game. ESPN had conditioned the fans to believe that USC/OKL were the two best teams in the county b/c they were atop the polls all season and everyone wanted to see that game. How does anyone know that AUB wouldn't have given USC a run for their money? I submit that it couldn't have been worse than OKL. Unfortunately, ESPN has a tremendous affect on viewers and voters alike, and I am convinced that several NC matchups (this year included) have been shaped by the talking heads at ESPN. Penn St, had no chance at a NC title shot once they lost b/c the media (ESPN) is bashing the Big10 based on the past three OSU debacles.

I love your analogy to Miss America because that's not too far off base. You know I will hope for some form of a playoff and a chance to settle it on the field for as long as I watch CFB. I will always think that a championship is something to be earned, and despite the faults of the system, I am glad that the two teams in this NC will have at least earned this one. To your point of OOC games, I also would love more great OOC games, but maybe this point would be moot if we had a playoff. In the current system, I can't say I really blame teams, particularly from the SEC and Big12, for not wanting tougher OOC schedules. In the past three years, both of these conferences have experienced times with as many as 6 or 7 teams in the top25. For a team that may have to play 4 or 5 of these teams, it is unrealistic IMO for people to bit*h about their OOC schedule. This is especially true of teams like '06 FLA and '08 OKL that played 2 teams ranked in the top 10 at the end of the season (3 if you include the NC game). As much as I hate it, I really can't blame teams from other conferences for not wanting tough OOC opponents. It's the way the system is set up, why put yourself at risk? Again I take you back to the 2006 season where the 3 best teams in the Big10 combined(OSU/UM/Wiscy) played only two OOC teams that were ranked (Texas and ND). For power houses that sell out their stadiums every week despite the opponent, why take a chance of getting beat just so you can have a marque matchup? That's where we're at.

In conclusion, I agree that the BCS su*ks! We need something more than the eyeball test because someone is getting screwed. I hope that the "media darling" syndrome is more bareable for you knowing that fans of all conferences have experienced it. The SEC has, the Big10 is, and even USC is feeling the sting b/c their conference got roughed up by the MWC. What can you do but survive it and hope you get back in their good graces. Unfortunately, that has its downside as well.

P.S. As an aside to the media bias, don't you think the SEC suffers every year because CBS (a non ABC company) has rights to their games. I thought this was particularly true this year. Maybe not in reputation but definitely in exposure. We must have had 5 College Gameday matchups in the Big12 this year, why? Didn't anyone find it a little odd that Texas jumped from #5 to #1 after their victory over OKL. And what about the jump TT made after the one point victory over Texas. They talk and talk about these teams, put them in the best light possible, and influence voters to increase their ranking. Part of me believes this is nothing more than hype for games that ABC/ESPN can air. Case in point, FLA and LSU (the past two NC's) played the same week as OKL and Tex this year, and I barely heard a peep from ESPN in the week leading up to that game. Maybe you've never paid any attention to this before but keep an eye out next season. They may discuss the game once it's over, but you would hardly now their was a Top10 showdown in the SEC in prior to the game. I understand that they don't want viewers tuning out ABC for a competing network, but it's bias all the same.

[amazinblue]

Thanks for the vote of confidence - I try to keep it real. I totally get your point on media bias. I guess it's one of two things: you're either built up or torn down by the media; they are never neutral. When the media loves you, you have two things working against you: 1) your conference's teams hear how great they are and think they can role out their jerseys and 2) teams from other conferences absolutely hate your guts and play tougher for it. I must remind you that even the SEC isn't immune to the disdain of the media, lest I remind you of the 2006 season. From our perspective, the SEC couldn't buy a vote of confidence. The SEC hadn't made a BCSNC appearance since 2003 and that one was disputed by USC. In 2006, we stomached talk about the game of the century (UM/OSU) for a month followed by non-stop centiment to rematch UM and OSU in the NC game. It was a lovefest, every bit as sickening as the one you are currently experiencing. I remember MUSHberger, Herbie, and Bob Davie commenting during the UM/OSU game that it didn't matter what happened in a month, this was the NC in their opinion. I even got it on tape so I can relive the moment and relish in their ignorance. The SEC just wanted a chance to prove it on the field. If OSU had won the last two NC games, we would have never heard the end of it. We would be the ones biatching about media bias, and maybe none of you would believe us. For the record, I am well aware of the media bias and I dispise it even when it is in our favor.

When the media hates you, it just sucks. Oh...that team just couldn't hang with those guys, they're clearly the best two teams in the country. Do you remember the 2004 season? Other than Auburn fans, nobody batted an eye about undefeated Auburn being left out of the NC game. ESPN had conditioned the fans to believe that USC/OKL were the two best teams in the county b/c they were atop the polls all season and everyone wanted to see that game. How does anyone know that AUB wouldn't have given USC a run for their money? I submit that it couldn't have been worse than OKL. Unfortunately, ESPN has a tremendous affect on viewers and voters alike, and I am convinced that several NC matchups (this year included) have been shaped by the talking heads at ESPN. Penn St, had no chance at a NC title shot once they lost b/c the media (ESPN) is bashing the Big10 based on the past three OSU debacles.

I love your analogy to Miss America because that's not too far off base. You know I will hope for some form of a playoff and a chance to settle it on the field for as long as I watch CFB. I will always think that a championship is something to be earned, and despite the faults of the system, I am glad that the two teams in this NC will have at least earned this one. To your point of OOC games, I also would love more great OOC games, but maybe this point would be moot if we had a playoff. In the current system, I can't say I really blame teams, particularly from the SEC and Big12, for not wanting tougher OOC schedules. In the past three years, both of these conferences have experienced times with as many as 6 or 7 teams in the top25. For a team that may have to play 4 or 5 of these teams, it is unrealistic IMO for people to bit*h about their OOC schedule. This is especially true of teams like '06 FLA and '08 OKL that played 2 teams ranked in the top 10 at the end of the season (3 if you include the NC game). As much as I hate it, I really can't blame teams from other conferences for not wanting tough OOC opponents. It's the way the system is set up, why put yourself at risk? Again I take you back to the 2006 season where the 3 best teams in the Big10 combined(OSU/UM/Wiscy) played only two OOC teams that were ranked (Texas and ND). For power houses that sell out their stadiums every week despite the opponent, why take a chance of getting beat just so you can have a marque matchup? That's where we're at.

In conclusion, I agree that the BCS su*ks! We need something more than the eyeball test because someone is getting screwed. I hope that the "media darling" syndrome is more bareable for you knowing that fans of all conferences have experienced it. The SEC has, the Big10 is, and even USC is feeling the sting b/c their conference got roughed up by the MWC. What can you do but survive it and hope you get back in their good graces. Unfortunately, that has its downside as well.

P.S. As an aside to the media bias, don't you think the SEC suffers every year because CBS (a non ABC company) has rights to their games. I thought this was particularly true this year. Maybe not in reputation but definitely in exposure. We must have had 5 College Gameday matchups in the Big12 this year, why? Didn't anyone find it a little odd that Texas jumped from #5 to #1 after their victory over OKL. And what about the jump TT made after the one point victory over Texas. They talk and talk about these teams, put them in the best light possible, and influence voters to increase their ranking. Part of me believes this is nothing more than hype for games that ABC/ESPN can air. Case in point, FLA and LSU (the past two NC's) played the same week as OKL and Tex this year, and I barely heard a peep from ESPN in the week leading up to that game. Maybe you've never paid any attention to this before but keep an eye out next season. They may discuss the game once it's over, but you would hardly now their was a Top10 showdown in the SEC in prior to the game. I understand that they don't want viewers tuning out ABC for a competing network, but it's bias all the same.

Gator,

I don't think there's any point you've made that I would disagree with strongly. I was thinking of starting a thread - "When is the BCS right?" - Since, the only time the BCS seemed to work in the past, or will work in the future is when you have two (and only two) undefeated teams - both from major conferences. This was the case with USC - Texas a few years ago. And, I thought that was a very good game - between two deserving teams.

So, the subjectivity of the polling process, and the computers, and the media (which certainly has more than a fair amount of ESPN / ABC / media bias) - makes comparing one loss teams nothing but a beauty pageant. And, though I may enjoy watching stunning babes strutting their stuff down a walkway - in a gown or swimsuit - at least those women are doing what's asked of them and are competing "on the walkway" for the title. I honestly wish that college would let football teams compete "on the field".

I think this season's a great example of many good one loss teams - those teams are Florida, Texas, Oklahoma, USC, Bama, Texas Tech, and Penn State - along with the two undefeateds - Utah and Boise State. No one can state for certain who the "best" two undefeateds are - I will give the nod to Florida because of the win over Bama, two of the three Big 12 teams are hard to separate - and anyone who says that USC doesn't "deserve" to play for it, IMO, doesn't know what they are talking about.

As a Gator fan - what did you think of the loss to Ole Miss? It was a close game, and the Rebels are a decent team. But, would you say that Florida played "one bad half" this entire season, and it was against Ole Miss. If so, I think that USC certainly can say the same about their loss at Oregon State, and PSU could say the same thing about their loss at Iowa.

I do think that Florida's very solid - and the media "promotes" the contests they'd like to see. And, your perspective about game day - it's dead on. I think Gameday made it to one Pac 10 game this season (Ohio State at USC), and to one Big 10 game (Penn State at Ohio State) - it seemed like everything else was below the Mason Dixon line.

This years Sugar Bowl - Bama vs. Utah. I have nothing against Bama - actually, I like their tradition and history, and someone I know was a coach there not too long ago. But, the media's giving Utah no chance of winning the Sugar Bowl. I will be rooting for Utah - just to show the media that they've got their heads up their a$$e$.

[gator]

Gator,

I don't think there's any point you've made that I would disagree with strongly. I was thinking of starting a thread - "When is the BCS right?" - Since, the only time the BCS seemed to work in the past, or will work in the future is when you have two (and only two) undefeated teams - both from major conferences. This was the case with USC - Texas a few years ago. And, I thought that was a very good game - between two deserving teams.

So, the subjectivity of the polling process, and the computers, and the media (which certainly has more than a fair amount of ESPN / ABC / media bias) - makes comparing one loss teams nothing but a beauty pageant. And, though I may enjoy watching stunning babes strutting their stuff down a walkway - in a gown or swimsuit - at least those women are doing what's asked of them and are competing "on the walkway" for the title. I honestly wish that college would let football teams compete "on the field".

I think this season's a great example of many good one loss teams - those teams are Florida, Texas, Oklahoma, USC, Bama, Texas Tech, and Penn State - along with the two undefeateds - Utah and Boise State. No one can state for certain who the "best" two undefeateds are - I will give the nod to Florida because of the win over Bama, two of the three Big 12 teams are hard to separate - and anyone who says that USC doesn't "deserve" to play for it, IMO, doesn't know what they are talking about.

As a Gator fan - what did you think of the loss to Ole Miss? It was a close game, and the Rebels are a decent team. But, would you say that Florida played "one bad half" this entire season, and it was against Ole Miss. If so, I think that USC certainly can say the same about their loss at Oregon State, and PSU could say the same thing about their loss at Iowa.

I do think that Florida's very solid - and the media "promotes" the contests they'd like to see. And, your perspective about game day - it's dead on. I think Gameday made it to one Pac 10 game this season (Ohio State at USC), and to one Big 10 game (Penn State at Ohio State) - it seemed like everything else was below the Mason Dixon line.

This years Sugar Bowl - Bama vs. Utah. I have nothing against Bama - actually, I like their tradition and history, and someone I know was a coach there not too long ago. But, the media's giving Utah no chance of winning the Sugar Bowl. I will be rooting for Utah - just to show the media that they've got their heads up their a$$e$.

amazin,

Unfortunately, this will probably be my last post for a week or so, headed out to San Francisco to give a presentation at the AGU conference. I'm taking a couple extra days for vacation; I leave tomorrow. I probably wasn't going to reply at all but you presented me with a very interesting question about the one loss teams. In particular you asked how I feel about the PSU, USC, and FLA losses this season. I certainly have some thoughts.

First, I can certainly understand anyone's position that FLA's loss was the worse of the three. They lost at home and to an unranked team. Further, at that point in the season Ole Miss already had two losses and went on to lose the two games after FLA. At the risk of sounding like a homer, I will try to present a reasonable argument why this loss was probably not the worst of the three.

First, I will say that Ole Miss is a talented team although this doesn't distinguish them from Ore St. or Iowa. Based on the current rankings, Ole Miss barely edges out each of these teams, so this cannot be the sole basis of my argument. However, I would make the point that neither Ole Miss or Iowa were blown out in any loss this season (all of them were one score games I believe). Ore St. one the other hand was blown out twice by Penn St and Oregon. All three teams played at least one top10 team.

The FLA/Ole Miss game: FLA was not dominated in that Ole Miss game at any point. In fact, FLA had a ten point lead going into halftime. The game changed when they turned the ball over twice in their first 4 second half plays from scrimmage inside their own 20. They weren't even good defensive plays, RB's just flat dropped the ball when Tebow handed it to them, before a defensive player even made contact. FLA loss the game because of a blocked PAT. I also think Ole Miss could have been penalized on that PAT because the defensive player jumped over one of our lineman, but that's neither here nor there. THe 4th down play was also interesting b/c it had been 4th and inches, then got reviewed and respotted as 4th and 2. I can't remember 100% if I had a gripe about that spot, but I want to say it should have been 4th and a full 1. FLA had already lined up to run a Tebow sneak prior to the remark, they just didn't change their play call. I was really suprised by the call seeing how we had already lost 3 O-lineman in that game. The sickest play of the day was the 2nd down befor the 4th down play, where Tebow overthrew a streaking, wideopen receiver by a yard or two at the 5 yrd line. If any of those plays goes the other way, we're talking about UF being undefeated. (Hmmm...don't want to start sounding like a whiner.) It was bad mistakes and bad breaks against a talented team. In all Ole Miss never lead by more than 7 pts at any point. I'm fairly positive that FLA responded on the following drive both times Ole Miss took the lead, except they missed the PAT on the last one.

Ore St/USC - I'm sure you caught that one didn't you. Do you remember that first half? Going into halftime, I would have sworn that OSU was the better team. USC had no answer for that running attack and got down 21-0. USC made a comeback, but OSU just outlasted them an got enough defensive pressure to get that BIG interception. USC is supposed to have absolutely the best D in the land, but they sure didn't look it that night. Further, they sure didn't play anyone else that could test them in the PAC10 this year.

Iowa/Penn St.-Probably the hardest loss of the three to stomach if you were a fan. They lead virtually the entire game and, like FL, even obtained a double digit lead(s). Then they lose an away game on a last second FG. Penn St. didn't do anything in that game to lose my respect. Again we can go back to media bias, as to why Penn St. immediately dropped from the NC discussion. The Big10 is perceived to be down, and Penn St didn't have any decent teams left on the schedule to play themselves back into the discussion.

All in all, I would say that the USC loss was worse than FLA, and that FLA's loss was worse than Penn St's. Fla just had the opponents left on the schedule and did what they had to do to get back in the discussion. Finally, the toughest loss of the season has to be Texas at Texas Tech. I mean a final second, almost hailmary in an away game....and now they aren't in the NC! That freaking svcks.

P.S. I don't want to rain on your parade because I like the media being wrong as next as the next guy; but I wouldn't hold my breath on getting it from the Utah/Alabama game. In all objectivity, I'm looking at matchups and I just don't see how Utah can matchup with Bama's O-line and D-line. I'll go out on a limb and say Bama's D is good, real good. They held FLA to 31 and forced 3 or 4 three-and-outs. Bama's O-line is a bunch of monsters. Nobody on Utah can matchup against Andre Smith, so Coffe and Ingram will run all day. I think it's realistic that Bama rolls up 250 on the ground against Utah.

[amazinblue]

amazin,

Unfortunately, this will probably be my last post for a week or so, headed out to San Francisco to give a presentation at the AGU conference. I'm taking a couple extra days for vacation; I leave tomorrow. I probably wasn't going to reply at all but you presented me with a very interesting question about the one loss teams. In particular you asked how I feel about the PSU, USC, and FLA losses this season. I certainly have some thoughts.

First, I can certainly understand anyone's position that FLA's loss was the worse of the three. They lost at home and to an unranked team. Further, at that point in the season Ole Miss already had two losses and went on to lose the two games after FLA. At the risk of sounding like a homer, I will try to present a reasonable argument why this loss was probably not the worst of the three.

First, I will say that Ole Miss is a talented team although this doesn't distinguish them from Ore St. or Iowa. Based on the current rankings, Ole Miss barely edges out each of these teams, so this cannot be the sole basis of my argument. However, I would make the point that neither Ole Miss or Iowa were blown out in any loss this season (all of them were one score games I believe). Ore St. one the other hand was blown out twice by Penn St and Oregon. All three teams played at least one top10 team.

The FLA/Ole Miss game: FLA was not dominated in that Ole Miss game at any point. In fact, FLA had a ten point lead going into halftime. The game changed when they turned the ball over twice in their first 4 second half plays from scrimmage inside their own 20. They weren't even good defensive plays, RB's just flat dropped the ball when Tebow handed it to them, before a defensive player even made contact. FLA loss the game because of a blocked PAT. I also think Ole Miss could have been penalized on that PAT because the defensive player jumped over one of our lineman, but that's neither here nor there. THe 4th down play was also interesting b/c it had been 4th and inches, then got reviewed and respotted as 4th and 2. I can't remember 100% if I had a gripe about that spot, but I want to say it should have been 4th and a full 1. FLA had already lined up to run a Tebow sneak prior to the remark, they just didn't change their play call. I was really suprised by the call seeing how we had already lost 3 O-lineman in that game. The sickest play of the day was the 2nd down befor the 4th down play, where Tebow overthrew a streaking, wideopen receiver by a yard or two at the 5 yrd line. If any of those plays goes the other way, we're talking about UF being undefeated. (Hmmm...don't want to start sounding like a whiner.) It was bad mistakes and bad breaks against a talented team. In all Ole Miss never lead by more than 7 pts at any point. I'm fairly positive that FLA responded on the following drive both times Ole Miss took the lead, except they missed the PAT on the last one.

Ore St/USC - I'm sure you caught that one didn't you. Do you remember that first half? Going into halftime, I would have sworn that OSU was the better team. USC had no answer for that running attack and got down 21-0. USC made a comeback, but OSU just outlasted them an got enough defensive pressure to get that BIG interception. USC is supposed to have absolutely the best D in the land, but they sure didn't look it that night. Further, they sure didn't play anyone else that could test them in the PAC10 this year.

Iowa/Penn St.-Probably the hardest loss of the three to stomach if you were a fan. They lead virtually the entire game and, like FL, even obtained a double digit lead(s). Then they lose an away game on a last second FG. Penn St. didn't do anything in that game to lose my respect. Again we can go back to media bias, as to why Penn St. immediately dropped from the NC discussion. The Big10 is perceived to be down, and Penn St didn't have any decent teams left on the schedule to play themselves back into the discussion.

All in all, I would say that the USC loss was worse than FLA, and that FLA's loss was worse than Penn St's. Fla just had the opponents left on the schedule and did what they had to do to get back in the discussion. Finally, the toughest loss of the season has to be Texas at Texas Tech. I mean a final second, almost hailmary in an away game....and now they aren't in the NC! That freaking svcks.

P.S. I don't want to rain on your parade because I like the media being wrong as next as the next guy; but I wouldn't hold my breath on getting it from the Utah/Alabama game. In all objectivity, I'm looking at matchups and I just don't see how Utah can matchup with Bama's O-line and D-line. I'll go out on a limb and say Bama's D is good, real good. They held FLA to 31 and forced 3 or 4 three-and-outs. Bama's O-line is a bunch of monsters. Nobody on Utah can matchup against Andre Smith, so Coffe and Ingram will run all day. I think it's realistic that Bama rolls up 250 on the ground against Utah.

Gator,

First, enjoy the conference and have a great time in the Bay area.

I think you've brought up points that I agree with. And, the overarching comment I'd have is - Oregon State, Ole Miss, and Iowa have all played some very solid football this season. And, the ability to pull an upset once in a season is something that people have to be aware of. Let's just look at major conferences this season - how many teams are undefeated? Zero. So, comparing losses is just very subjective - and I actually think that college football fans follow the game more closely than many of the voters in the polls do.

I have my opinions about which teams are "really good" this season. No doubt that Florida and USC have been on a tear since their early season losses. Oklahoma and Texas have played solid ball as well. Bama played well - but suffered the loss to Florida last weekend. And, Penn State's loss - well, the only downfall of the season.

People have been quick to describe the Big 10 and Pac 10 as "down" conferences this season. And, that may be fair - but, people have also said the SEC is down this year too. So, these comparisons are really just a beauty contest or pi$$ing contest - since everyone has their own prejudices, alliances, and preferences - and, everyone's entitled to their opinion.

I just think of these teams - Florida, Oklahoma, Texas, USC, and Penn State - which teams loss was "most acceptable", or "least acceptable" - and, no one, IMO, can accurately say these are the "two best" teams from that group. What I find interesting is - if you changed the "poll positions" of these teams - how would their BCS rankings change. I think of last season - the final polls - Michigan and Florida finished with identical records - Michigan just defeated Florida in a bowl game - and Florida was ranked higher than Michigan in every poll. I would like to hear how voters justified their vote. No logic or rationale...

It's why they should all be part of an approach to settle it on the field. It could be done, and it would be great if (in fact) it was settled that way. As another thread as said - any structured playoff would be better than the beauty pageant we have today.