Violations?

[Wolvrin704]

http://www.dispatch.com/live/content/sports/stories/2010/05/30/most-on-staff-barred-from-coaching-players.html?sid=101

Here is a small snippet from the article....


"It's time for us to get better," he said. "Have guys like Marcus Freeman, who's not our position coach, help us do small things and go over things with him."

If Rolle works with Freeman, though, whether it's watching video together or doing drills, Ohio State could be committing an NCAA violation.

That's because Freeman is a quality-control coach, which the NCAA considers a non-coaching staff member. According to NCAA bylaw 11.7.1.1.1.1.1, staffers such as Freeman are "prohibited from participating in instructional activities with student-athletes and any on-field activities."

Hmmmmm, interesting indeed. Seems like we have been told repeatedly that this does not happen at other schools and certainly not at THE Ohio State University.

[amazinblue]

704,

Wouldn't this be a major violation?

[rickyleach]

look you have to be a total idiot not to think schools like ohio state are not crossing the line on practice / other activities , just like what michigan did, they havent been turned in yet and they dont worry about news papers like the detriot free press to call them out on it with every little thing they do.the c/bus dispatch would never do somthing like what the freee press did, ohio state owns them ... atleast in terms of making or breaking them.

[NorCal Buckeye]

704,

Wouldn't this be a major violation?

It would appear to be when you have tattle tale players crying to mud raking enemy news rags about it, with an unpopular goober as their target of opportunity. LOL.

[Wolvrin704]

It would appear to be when you have tattle tale players crying to mud raking enemy news rags about it, with an unpopular goober as their target of opportunity. LOL.

What players were tattle tales? Please tell me. I and others have told you waht happened and are still spreading disinformation. If you want to debate then use the correct facts!

[1OSUNUT]

I have no idea what you cheaters are talking about. Sounds like blah,blah,blah to me. :)

[Wolvrin704]

I have no idea what you cheaters are talking about. Sounds like blah,blah,blah to me. :)

Hey its your paper and your player saying it. :)

What are you guys going to say if the NCAA comes knocking on the door to OSU's AD about such supposed violations? I doubt it happens but its now a matter of public record and could happen.

[amazinblue]

Hey its your paper and your player saying it. :)

What are you guys going to say if the NCAA comes knocking on the door to OSU's AD about such supposed violations? I doubt it happens but its now a matter of public record and could happen.

This would be a MAJOR violation. And, I'm wondering if the NCAA allows a school to self-report MAJOR violations.

[rickyleach]

if this is a major violation on osu , i believe they will blindfold tressel lead him to the top of the horse shoe and push him off into the olentangy river .

[amazinblue]

I wonder how many of the hundreds of OSU's self-reported violations would be considered MAJOR by the NCAA if the Columbus Dispatch had reported them and the violation had gotten to the NCAA before OSU reported it.

Correct me if I'm wrong - but, Michigan has had 9 self-reported violations in the last 6 years, and I believe OSU has self-reported over 400 in that same period.

[Wolvrin704]

They DON'T for teams whose head coaches are a model for reneging on contracts, and telling the fans to go to hell. Actually they have set up a hit squad of investigators for one coach (I won't name names) who they want to get out of the NCAA, because of all the bad publicity he has generated. LOL!

<GASP!> I can't believe you are talking about JT like that!

Seriously, please show us the info that says there is a hit squad to get RR or any other coach by the NCAA. I want names and facts. If you can't provide one shred of evidence about your allegation then you should either be permanently banned or sit back and shut up.

[NorCal Buckeye]

<GASP!> I can't believe you are talking about JT like that!

Seriously, please show us the info that says there is a hit squad to get RR or any other coach by the NCAA. I want names and facts. If you can't provide one shred of evidence about your allegation then you should either be permanently banned or sit back and shut up.

FreeP.com says the NCAA investigation is still looking into PERSONAL sanctions against Rodriguez. And of course, the jury is still out on what they are going to do against the university. That's all I can say for now, BigHouse is threatening to throw me off the board again for speaking freely as a Buckeye fan, even in the OSU section of the forum.

What's the fun in all of this if you're subject to gag orders from the moderators. Do you guys go crying to them all the time? One would think you would like the give and take of banter, smack talk, and capping on each other. I can take it, why can't you guys?

[Wolvrin704]

FreeP.com says the NCAA investigation is still looking into PERSONAL sanctions against Rodriguez. And of course, the jury is still out on what they are going to do against the university. That's all I can say for now, BigHouse is threatening to throw me off the board again for speaking freely as a Buckeye fan, even in the OSU section of the forum.

What's the fun in all of this if you're subject to gag orders from the moderators. Do you guys go crying to them all the time? One would think you would like the give and take of banter, smack talk, and capping on each other. I can take it, why can't you guys?

Probably has to do with you throwing around "facts" that have no basis. First of all I've not seen nor heard anything of the kind about RR and that does not constitute a hit squad. If so then the NCAA is no longer an impartial governing body and has an agenda. Secondly since you proclaim to read the Freep that tells me all I need to know about how far you are willing to go to find dirt on UM and RR because as we all know the Freep has a personal agenda against RR and are willing to print malicious stories that are in fact outright bold faced lies. They are committing journalistic suicide up there in Detroit and they won't realize it until the paper folds up.

As for your "talk and banter". We are in here to debate not to stir crap up. If thats the case why can't you take it when Ricky does it to you? Why is it you cannot engage in actual debate? That's what forums are all about. You like to spew spout off so much inconsistencies, illogical arguments, blatant falsehoods and stretch the truth but if someone even comes close to doing the same to your beloved OSU you get all huffy and scream about having to protect your program. You think we will do less than the same? You are SO inconsistent with your statements it drives me insane.

Why is it that trolls seem to think they are above the rules? Why do they think they cannot assimilate into the culture of where they are at? Every business, social group, fan base, church or any other group of human beings has what you would call a social culture. If you want to step outside of it thats fine but usually in such groups there are repercussions. Why is it the trolls are delirious that RR got "caught" breaking the rules and is going to be punished but its not ok for them to be punished when they break the rules? The way the act is that we are lving in feudalism and there should be one set of rules for what they are allowed to do and what everyone else should have to abide by.

[NorCal Buckeye]

Probably has to do with you throwing around "facts" that have no basis. First of all I've not seen nor heard anything of the kind about RR and that does not constitute a hit squad. If so then the NCAA is no longer an impartial governing body and has an agenda. Secondly since you proclaim to read the Freep that tells me all I need to know about how far you are willing to go to find dirt on UM and RR because as we all know the Freep has a personal agenda against RR and are willing to print malicious stories that are in fact outright bold faced lies. They are committing journalistic suicide up there in Detroit and they won't realize it until the paper folds up.

As for your "talk and banter". We are in here to debate not to stir crap up. If thats the case why can't you take it when Ricky does it to you? Why is it you cannot engage in actual debate? That's what forums are all about. You like to spew spout off so much inconsistencies, illogical arguments, blatant falsehoods and stretch the truth but if someone even comes close to doing the same to your beloved OSU you get all huffy and scream about having to protect your program. You think we will do less than the same? You are SO inconsistent with your statements it drives me insane.

Why is it that trolls seem to think they are above the rules? Why do they think they cannot assimilate into the culture of where they are at? Every business, social group, fan base, church or any other group of human beings has what you would call a social culture. If you want to step outside of it thats fine but usually in such groups there are repercussions. Why is it the trolls are delirious that RR got "caught" breaking the rules and is going to be punished but its not ok for them to be punished when they break the rules? The way the act is that we are lving in feudalism and there should be one set of rules for what they are allowed to do and what everyone else should have to abide by.

LOL! This is a college football forum, not a debate society! Opinions and feelings is what it is all about, not protocol and procedural rules. Or gag orders!

As for Ricky...what can I say!? LOL.

[Wolvrin704]

LOL! This is a college football forum, not a debate society! Opinions and feelings is what it is all about, not protocol and procedural rules. Or gag orders!

As for Ricky...what can I say!? LOL.

Ok so you are saying that facts and figures have no place here? Should have known since you ignore them so much ad never let a true fact get in your way before.

Make him walk the plank Mr Rogers!

[Silver Bullet]

http://www.dispatch.com/live/content/sports/stories/2010/05/30/most-on-staff-barred-from-coaching-players.html?sid=101

Here is a small snippet from the article....



Hmmmmm, interesting indeed. Seems like we have been told repeatedly that this does not happen at other schools and certainly not at THE Ohio State University.

It's amusing that you are on here preaching about fact-based arguments then make a statement like this. Can you show me where anyone has said that these type of minor violations didn't/don't occur at OSU? Now, I HAVE said that the reason why myself and other OSU fans have made a big deal about the Um situation is because we were told for years that these things didn't happen at Um which of course was wrong. I will say, that there have never been any questions about Tressel or anyone on his staff lying to NCAA investigators or trying to cover up any improprieties...can Um make that statement?

Now, I'll probably get another violation against me for trolling for making this point but it's worth it. I know, maybe I could ask that anyone who posts anything from a major newspaper that casts OSU in a negative light be "violated." I say if the Dispatch posts one more mean article about OSU we invoke my proposal and that all OSU fans on the board also be allowed to cover our ears and shut eyes like the Um contingent do when something they don't like is posted or said about them. Seriously, this is what this board has turned into? No wonder many of the original posters (on both sides) don't bother coming here anymore. Just an FYI guys, there are a million places a Um or OSU fan could go to participate in one-sided conversations. This place was always different and that is what made it so great in my mind. Now it's turned into a place to go to listen to OSU be ripped and to be "violated" if you hit back. In fact, it's become so paranoid that local MI newspaper articles aren't allowed to be posted because they don't follow the narrative.

Anyways, enjoy yourselves and fight the good fight Nut, NocCal and Don. I'm tired of the hypocrisy. Also, Ricky...huge fan. I think they tamed you down a little lately but your posts were one of the most enjoyable things on here.

Go Bucks!

EDIT - By the way, you guys may want to delete/edit this little bit under the OSU forum listing:

Forum: Ohio State

Here in Michigan, we believe in Freedom of Speech -- even if we don't agree with it. Here's the place for the Buckeyes and their detractors to discuss TUOS sports.

It's almost laughable at this point.

[tpilews]

EDIT - By the way, you guys may want to delete/edit this little bit under the OSU forum listing:

Forum: Ohio State

Here in Michigan, we believe in Freedom of Speech -- even if we don't agree with it. Here's the place for the Buckeyes and their detractors to discuss TUOS sports.

It's almost laughable at this point.

Why's that? I've never given anyone an infraction the tuos section. The only time it would be warranted would be for directly attacking a member of the board. Quit crying about infractions this, infractions that, you all will have your opportunity to judge each others posts soon, if the editor gets around to it.

[Silver Bullet]

Why's that? I've never given anyone an infraction the tuos section. The only time it would be warranted would be for directly attacking a member of the board. Quit crying about infractions this, infractions that, you all will have your opportunity to judge each others posts soon, if the editor gets around to it.

There are two moderators aren't there? Here is what happened:



You have received an infraction at Hail Victors Michigan Sports Forums

Dear Silver Bullet,

You have received an infraction at Hail Victors Michigan Sports Forums.

Reason: Trolling/Flaming
-------
so very wrong
-------

This infraction is worth 1 point(s) and may result in restricted access until it expires. Serious infractions will never expire.

Original Post:
http://www.hailvictors.com/showthread.php?p=45732
Quote Originally Posted by Wolvrin704 View Post
Then why did you guys verbally crucify RR about Dorsey but its acceptable for JT if 10% or less of your roster entails risky kids?

I'm sorry, but was Tressel supposed to somehow know all of this was going to happen before it happened? That's a lot different then offering a scholarship to a known law-breaker. This is apples to oranges here. By the way, the reason the Dorsey thing is so funny to us is that 99% of college programs offer scholarships to kids that have a checkered past. 99% of the people on this board thought Um was above that and would never accept a kid with those types of problems because Um is sooooo much holier than thou. That's also what makes the NCAA investigations so fantastic.

All the best,
Hail Victors Michigan Sports Forums


It was classified as trolling because it was "So very wrong." What a joke.

[Wolvrin704]

It's amusing that you are on here preaching about fact-based arguments then make a statement like this. Can you show me where anyone has said that these type of minor violations didn't/don't occur at OSU? Now, I HAVE said that the reason why myself and other OSU fans have made a big deal about the Um situation is because we were told for years that these things didn't happen at Um which of course was wrong. I will say, that there have never been any questions about Tressel or anyone on his staff lying to NCAA investigators or trying to cover up any improprieties...can Um make that statement?

Ok at this point we are talking about 2 very different issues. The trolls have come after UM hard because of MAJOR violations which constitute what the article that I posted in the OP of this thread is about. We all know minor violations happen at OSU because they have taken the philosophy of "if we report all the minor stuff they won't investigate anything at all", and the fact is OSU is far and above any ther school for self reported violations. Thats both a good and bad thing. Its good because they are good at self policing and finding issues before the fester and become a big issue (such as happened at UM) but also bad because the fact is they have a lot of issues that are happening. So with that said if what the article said does happen then OSU could very well become guilty of MAJOR violations as well.

Now, as far bashing us because we have claimed no wrongdoing for years.....can you say that we have gotten our just desserts? How long must we continue to be bashed over it? How long do you think you can bash without repercussions? Fact is that a few of the trolls like to disseminate so much false information that I will rise to the challenge because if its not done they continue spouting it until it becomes "fact".

[Wolvrin704]

Sorry but I just have to say something else here SB. Maybe it will not be well received by either side but so be it. I understand what you are saying about this was a place that both sides could come together and have conversation on the merits of CFB and I think more than a few of us have misunderstood that of this place as we construed it be a UM fan website only. To be honest I don't mind OSU fans being here as I like to debate as well as anyone. IMO, what really began to change the website was the constant attacking of RR by those on the OSU side of fandom and by posters such as RTB. I have no problem with people questioning what is being done but lets have a genuine debate about it and be willing to debate the issues but when people want to bash regardless of facts or what those in power of the programs say then I think they are treading on dangerous ground with the powers that be here and deservedly so. You can have an opinion of anything you want but be willing to back up that opinion with genuine debate and facts rather than....."X just sucks because I say so".

I may not agree with your opinions SB but I will say that you usually put great care and thought into them and back them up unlike a few others.

[Silver Bullet]

Ok at this point we are talking about 2 very different issues. The trolls have come after UM hard because of MAJOR violations which constitute what the article that I posted in the OP of this thread is about. We all know minor violations happen at OSU because they have taken the philosophy of "if we report all the minor stuff they won't investigate anything at all", and the fact is OSU is far and above any ther school for self reported violations. Thats both a good and bad thing. Its good because they are good at self policing and finding issues before the fester and become a big issue (such as happened at UM) but also bad because the fact is they have a lot of issues that are happening. So with that said if what the article said does happen then OSU could very well become guilty of MAJOR violations as well.

Now, as far bashing us because we have claimed no wrongdoing for years.....can you say that we have gotten our just desserts? How long must we continue to be bashed over it? How long do you think you can bash without repercussions? Fact is that a few of the trolls like to disseminate so much false information that I will rise to the challenge because if its not done they continue spouting it until it becomes "fact".

For years on this site OSU has been called a cheating/dishonest institution, in a redneck backwoods state inhabited by trailer trash (which is completely awesome since half of you guys live in Ohio) led by a scumbag head coach. Again, since the site's inception. It's all part of the rivalry I say. I know it isn't true, but it's all in fun. The accusation that seems most prevalent however is the whole "OSU is a dirty program" argument. So for many YEARS this has been slung our way and for many years we couldn't really turn the tables on you guys. We had to sit there and take it. Enter RR.

I'm a Lloyd Carr fan. He mad the rivalry painful, but I think he was an honest guy and great coach. I think the way he was run out on a rail was horrible. I think the guy that replaced him is a dis-honest person. So in comes RR to replace Lloyd Carr. With him comes his arrogance (while accomplishing little in his career), his dishonesty (they way he bailed on WV was despicable) and his infractions. So after years of getting called some pretty racy things from Um fans all this happens and OSU fans are supposed to just sit here and say nothing?

I agree that you should be able to call out OSU fans if we say something untrue and I'm fine with eliminating personal attacks. But when people are getting dinged for making actual arguments like I did, or when NEWSPAPER articles are forbidden simply on the basis of the banner from which under they appear then we aren't have a friendly back and forth any longer. I understand why Nut continues to post here, but he's playing against a stacked deck and people that support the rigged system around here are not the kind of people that you can hope to have any meaningful conversation with. I only hope the editor gets a chance to read this before it's erased.

[NorCal Buckeye]

Sorry but I just have to say something else here SB. Maybe it will not be well received by either side but so be it. I understand what you are saying about this was a place that both sides could come together and have conversation on the merits of CFB and I think more than a few of us have misunderstood that of this place as we construed it be a UM fan website only. To be honest I don't mind OSU fans being here as I like to debate as well as anyone. IMO, what really began to change the website was the constant attacking of RR by those on the OSU side of fandom and by posters such as RTB. I have no problem with people questioning what is being done but lets have a genuine debate about it and be willing to debate the issues but when people want to bash regardless of facts or what those in power of the programs say then I think they are treading on dangerous ground with the powers that be here and deservedly so. You can have an opinion of anything you want but be willing to back up that opinion with genuine debate and facts rather than....."X just sucks because I say so".

I may not agree with your opinions SB but I will say that you usually put great care and thought into them and back them up unlike a few others.

Try backing up your own big mouth...show me anywhere on the forum where it says posters must provide indisputable evidence to support their OPINIONS and FEELINGS about ANYTHING. That's right Mr. 704, it is not a prerequisite. And who appointed you judge and jury here anyway? Your opinion carries no more weight than anyone elses. All you and your ilk is doing to this forum is strangling the membership and fun out of it with peevish crybabyism.

[Wolvrin704]

Try backing up your own big mouth...show me anywhere on the forum where it says posters must provide indisputable evidence to support their OPINIONS and FEELINGS about ANYTHING. That's right Mr. 704, it is not a prerequisite. And who appointed you judge and jury here anyway? Your opinion carries no more weight than anyone elses. All you and your ilk is doing to this forum is strangling the membership and fun out of it with peevish crybabyism.

No my opinion does not carry more weight but anyone with any amount of sense knows that if you want to argue/debate about a subject you should bring forth facts and figures to support your argument. Otherwise its like bringing a gun with no ammo, its just an empty gun. Here is the crux of what really bothers me about you; when we make statements or opinions you want to bash just the same as we do and argue about it and even say our arguments are meaningless. Yet on the other hand you can make baseless statements and arguments with absolutely no validity to them and its ok. At least when I counter I am doing so on the merits of your statements using facts that can be corroborated and many times prove yours to be false.

I take offense to you calling me a crybaby. All I ask is that when you make a contention that you back up your argument with facts. You keep making statments that are shown to be blatantly false and you just ignore it and move unto the next outlandish statement. For me to call you on it is being a crybaby? Grow up and be a man.

[amazinblue]

... To be honest I don't mind OSU fans being here as I like to debate as well as anyone. IMO, what really began to change the website was the constant attacking of RR by those on the OSU side of fandom and by posters such as RTB. I have no problem with people questioning what is being done but lets have a genuine debate about it ...

I may not agree with your opinions SB but I will say that you usually put great care and thought into them and back them up unlike a few others.

704,

Agreed. I think that people are confusing a few things on the board. One of the items is "opinions" and "arguments". This doesn't need to turn into a Law Review type of forum - but, so many of the positions posted are truly facetious and based upon a subjective opinon - such as "He's a dirt bag or scum." I believe I'm beyond the "potty mouth" stage of adolescence and would welcome interesting challenges to various points of view.

SB has made some points - and, like 704, I appreciate the thought that goes into a point or argument and conditionally respect one's opinion whether I agree with it or not. The condition is - there has to be some intelligence that has gone into the formulation of the argument / opinion.

As for SB - I really have to wonder why you mention how Carr was "run out of town". What did the Michigan administration do to "force him out" or "fire him" as some have said. IMO, Carr left on his own terms - he signed his staff to two year contracts providing security for them if they weren't kept by the next coach - he saw his senior class (Henne, Hart, Long) through to their graduation, and he took a position in the Athletic Department after he retired. You may feel he should have been allowed to personally choose his successor - I do not believe that's a "right" for a coach - whether successful or not.

Perhaps as the season draws closer we can discuss the strengths and weaknesses of our respective football teams and intelligently argue the ability to be successful. I would enjoy a discussion or thread that talked about whether a QB has demonstrated either the maturity or decision making ability to lead their team through the season, whether a QB's arm strength and accuracy are enough to win tight and competitive games, or whether a team's offense / defensive philosophy is balanced enough to ensure they'll be successful. Maybe August will be that time... maybe it won't - I'm hoping it arrives sooner than that.

[NorCal Buckeye]

704,

Agreed. I think that people are confusing a few things on the board. One of the items is "opinions" and "arguments". This doesn't need to turn into a Law Review type of forum - but, so many of the positions posted are truly facetious and based upon a subjective opinon - such as "He's a dirt bag or scum." I believe I'm beyond the "potty mouth" stage of adolescence and would welcome interesting challenges to various points of view.

SB has made some points - and, like 704, I appreciate the thought that goes into a point or argument and conditionally respect one's opinion whether I agree with it or not. The condition is - there has to be some intelligence that has gone into the formulation of the argument / opinion.

As for SB - I really have to wonder why you mention how Carr was "run out of town". What did the Michigan administration do to "force him out" or "fire him" as some have said. IMO, Carr left on his own terms - he signed his staff to two year contracts providing security for them if they weren't kept by the next coach - he saw his senior class (Henne, Hart, Long) through to their graduation, and he took a position in the Athletic Department after he retired. You may feel he should have been allowed to personally choose his successor - I do not believe that's a "right" for a coach - whether successful or not.

Perhaps as the season draws closer we can discuss the strengths and weaknesses of our respective football teams and intelligently argue the ability to be successful. I would enjoy a discussion or thread that talked about whether a QB has demonstrated either the maturity or decision making ability to lead their team through the season, whether a QB's arm strength and accuracy are enough to win tight and competitive games, or whether a team's offense / defensive philosophy is balanced enough to ensure they'll be successful. Maybe August will be that time... maybe it won't - I'm hoping it arrives sooner than that.

You're still expecting that junior varsity team of yours to do something this year? LOL, I hope you're not holding your breath waiting for it to happen. As if getting past OSU, IA, WI, PSU, and MSU (all bowl teams) isn't going to be tough enough, I see in Rivals today where UConn and Purdue are expected to be two of the most improved teams in the country this year. And let's not forget the smoking Illannoy has put on your heinies the last two years. That's eight teams right there that I don't think this year's version of AA JV will be able to tackle (no pun). God help you all, and Rodriguez, if Massachusetts pulls off an Appalachia State too. Yeah, it ought to be a real interesting season...

[rickyleach]

norcal doesnt like me ,poor old norcal , everyone wipes their ass with this guy , and i love it ,

[amazinblue]

You're still expecting that junior varsity team of yours to do something this year? LOL, I hope you're not holding your breath waiting for it to happen. As if getting past OSU, IA, WI, PSU, and MSU (all bowl teams) isn't going to be tough enough, I see in Rivals today where UConn and Purdue are expected to be two of the most improved teams in the country this year. And let's not forget the smoking Illannoy has put on your heinies the last two years. That's eight teams right there that I don't think this year's version of AA JV will be able to tackle (no pun). God help you all, and Rodriguez, if Massachusetts pulls off an Appalachia State too. Yeah, it ought to be a real interesting season...

NorCal,

I believe we have a wager on the season record - correct? I'll let my prediction speak for itself.

Regarding WHO Michigan plays this season - and their predicted records - well, if Michigan should happen to finish 8-4, they'd have to have beaten several of these bowl teams you identified. I'm confident the team can have a solid record this season and improve upon last season. IF the team stays healthy and the QB makes sound decisions - I believe a lot of people will be impressed with the progress and see the results (on the field) of the hard work this team has put into their conditioning and preparation for the last two years.

I don't wish illness or injury upon anyone - but, if TP has a significant injury that keeps him out of several games this year - who's going to lead the vaunted OSU offense?