Will Michigan and Nebraska become rivals?

[bighousemike84]

I dont know much of any history between Michigan and Nebraska beyond the Alamo Bowl of a few years ago. Nebraska has been a powerful program for a long time and it is only natural for those powerhouse programs to oppose one another but I wonder if any kind of rivalry will grow out of potential matchups.

Some of it is dependent on how the two divisons shape up, that will dictate exactly how often Michigan even gets to play Nebraska. Also I dont see that Michigan has any more room for another rivalry. With the big 3 of Ohio State, Michigan State, and Notre Dame, and the growing rivalry with Penn State, Michigan has no room to add another rivalry game to the schedule. I would love to see a nasty dort of rivalry develop between the Maize and Blue and Big Red but I just dont see it happening.

[bighousemike84]

Speaking of rivalries, I am curious to know how you rank the 3 rivals that Michigan has?

Of course, there should be no question of the first team on the list, Ohio State, the hated and despised buckeyes are now and always will be Michigans greatest rival. That doesnt mean that there isnt some extra hate to go around for the FYS Spartans. Michigan State is a particularly annoying sort of rival, they cant admit theyre own shortcomings and everything that Michigan says or does is misconstrued as a shot at gang green. Last but not least, Notre Dame. I actually love the Notre Dame rivalry, I love the tradition of the two schools and I love the feel that you get with this particular rivalry. With OSU, you just hat the color and everything that is associated with it, For MSU its a battle for the state and it goes so far beyond the colors or the success or lack thereof on the field. With Notre Dame the feel is more akin to old timey football, a sense of being a part of something that has been around for a very long time.

Ohio State has to be first, Michigan State is a close second, and Notre Dame is the respected but hated rival.

[1OSUNUT]

Nebraska will be a big game - but not a rival. Whenever two teams with that much history and tradition take the field its a big deal and an interesting game - but its not a rival. Ohio State and Penn State have played several games the last few years with a lot riding on it - the games are always a big deal and a prime time event - but they are not a rival. The Buckeyes and Iowa have had some big games - they are not a rival, at least not to Buckeye fans. Teams like Ohio State and Michigan are games teams circle because of what they stand for and the tradition of greatness that they have. To me a rival is somebody you dislike a team where there are undertones and sub plots. A rivalry like Ohio State and Michigan is not just played out on the field - it is played out in the stands, in front of TV's, on the streets and in chat rooms like this. That is a rivalry - anything other then that is just a big game.

[blue in pennsylvania]

Speaking of rivalries, I am curious to know how you rank the 3 rivals that Michigan has?

Of course, there should be no question of the first team on the list, Ohio State, the hated and despised buckeyes are now and always will be Michigans greatest rival. That doesnt mean that there isnt some extra hate to go around for the FYS Spartans. Michigan State is a particularly annoying sort of rival, they cant admit theyre own shortcomings and everything that Michigan says or does is misconstrued as a shot at gang green. Last but not least, Notre Dame. I actually love the Notre Dame rivalry, I love the tradition of the two schools and I love the feel that you get with this particular rivalry. With OSU, you just hat the color and everything that is associated with it, For MSU its a battle for the state and it goes so far beyond the colors or the success or lack thereof on the field. With Notre Dame the feel is more akin to old timey football, a sense of being a part of something that has been around for a very long time.

Ohio State has to be first, Michigan State is a close second, and Notre Dame is the respected but hated rival.

My list is msu first osu second and minnesota third. I hate to lose and although beating osu is better than beating msu, losing to msu is much worse. Losing to msu has a kicked in the gut feeling, there msu for gods sake. As far as nd goes there not a conference game and it has never made a difference on going to the rose bowl. Give me the little brown jug instead.

[Revelli]

Rivalries in order of importance (according to me, that is):

1. OSU- enough said!
2. Notre Dame- I too get the old time football feel from this rivalry, but despise how they claim to be the originator of so many traditions that they stole from Michigan.
3. Penn State- This is becoming a rivalry that I feel is almost on par with the Notre Dame rivalry.
4. Minnesota- Little Brown Jug... Second oldest trophy in college football, oldest CONSECUTIVE trophy in college football.
5. MSU- I mean who really cares about MSU? I consider them on the same plain as a rivalry with Indiana or Northwestern... non-existant. The rivalry is all about them hating us and we don't really care about them which makes them hate us more. Go away sparty... you're like a tag-along kid brother. Thus the Mike Hart comment.

[1OSUNUT]

Where does MSU honestly rank ? Some have them higher then Ohio State at #1, some have them #2 behind Ohio State, some have them #3 behind Ohio State and ND and one person says they don't matter and have them at #5. Why such a big difference in opinion ?

[hail2mich]

Nebraska will be a rivalry just because of 1997. Before they joined we have always gone back and forth with them on which team was better.

OSU is obviously number one. I put MSU at two because they have a history of winning some very controversial games over us and gloating, even though we own them. MSU fans think they are our biggest rival, but they are just dreaming. They really are little brother and everyone knows it. Plus I hate that jackass of a coach they have. I do think they are our number one rival in BB and hockey. ND is number three. Classic football between two teams that I believe are classy programs. Minnesota is fourth just because of the Little Belrown Jug. After that I don't see any rivals in the Big Ten. The Penn St game is always one I look forward to, but I don't think it's a rivalry.

Overall though, nothing compare to the OSU rivalry.

[hail2mich]

Where does MSU honestly rank ? Some have them higher then Ohio State at #1, some have them #2 behind Ohio State, some have them #3 behind Ohio State and ND and one person says they don't matter and have them at #5. Why such a big difference in opinion ?

I think some people put MSU at one because up in Michigan, they might have to endure more MSU fans than OSU. I have a few friends in Grand Rapids and they feel MSU is number one for that reason. Also, like stated earlier, losing to MSU is completely unacceptable and should never happen. They are a second tier program. At least with a loss to OSU, you know you lost to a good team.

[Wolvrin704]

First of all every team in B10 considers UM a rival so I can forsee Nebraska being no different especially considering our history with them over the past 13 years.
NUT- the orders listed are all opinions, we know well how varied opinions can be. Since UM has so many rivals the list can and will change drastically from person to person and even year to year. To me MSU is a huge rival now since they have beat us for 2 years straight and they think they now own us for some crazy reason. If not for that they would not be as high as they are anymore because of our dominance in the rivalry. Without further ado, my list....

1. OSU
2. MSU
3. ND
4. PSU
5. Wiscy
6. Minnesota
7. Iowa
8. Illinois
9. Purdue
10. NW
11. IU

[rickyleach]

Where does MSU honestly rank ? Some have them higher then Ohio State at #1, some have them #2 behind Ohio State, some have them #3 behind Ohio State and ND and one person says they don't matter and have them at #5. Why such a big difference in opinion ?

nut i thought tressel was trying to build a rivalry with youngstown state .

[Revelli]

Where does MSU honestly rank ? Some have them higher then Ohio State at #1, some have them #2 behind Ohio State, some have them #3 behind Ohio State and ND and one person says they don't matter and have them at #5. Why such a big difference in opinion ?

The ranking largely depends on where you come from in the state of Michigan (if you grew up here). We who grew up along the Michigan/Ohio border couldn't care less about MSU. Those who grew up closer to Lansing or anywhere north of it, HATE OSU and really dislike MSU. So I guess it is relative to how much you have to listen to the other team's fans go on about how much better they are than us and why. I will say this,... at least OSU fans have a leg to stand on when having this argument... MSU, not so much.

[blue in pennsylvania]

Let me say that penn state fans down where I live absolutley HATE michigan. OSU now is as hated since TP left for tresselville. Its kind of sad for psu since their top two rivals (Pitt, West Virginia) are not on their schedule anymore. PSU fans get irate with me when I tell them PSU is no higher than 4th on Michigans rival list.

[RADRACING]

Nebraska will be a big game - but not a rival. Whenever two teams with that much history and tradition take the field its a big deal and an interesting game - but its not a rival. Ohio State and Penn State have played several games the last few years with a lot riding on it - the games are always a big deal and a prime time event - but they are not a rival. The Buckeyes and Iowa have had some big games - they are not a rival, at least not to Buckeye fans. Teams like Ohio State and Michigan are games teams circle because of what they stand for and the tradition of greatness that they have. To me a rival is somebody you dislike a team where there are undertones and sub plots. A rivalry like Ohio State and Michigan is not just played out on the field - it is played out in the stands, in front of TV's, on the streets and in chat rooms like this. That is a rivalry - anything other then that is just a big game.

Ohio State is Penn States biggest rival, they are just too ignorant to know it in Columbus.

[Gobluerebirth]

With Rivalries I rank who I want to beat more, and who I really don't want to lose to.
1. OSU, I love beating them and hate losing to them the most.
2. MSU, I run into MSU fans probably a total of 10 times a year in Central Ohio. It's still annoying. And I know my fellow bretheren up north have to deal with their shit. It's more of a Hate losing with them. Also Trophy.
3. ND, Tradition, mostly the overhype of ND every year.
4.Minny- Trophy. We shouldn't lose to them.

[amazinblue]

Ohio State is Penn States biggest rival, they are just too ignorant to know it in Columbus.

Rad,

Not according to the PSU fans I know. The school they (PSU) wants to beat in the Big 10 is Michigan.

I think the challenge is that the Buckeyes have one rival Michigan. And, Michigan has a target on their jersey against most every team in the Big 10. The order I would place the schools suggested is 1) OSU, 2) MSU, 3) ND, and 4) PSU. The Brown Jug is nice - but, it's not what it once was.

If you go to other Big 10 campuses - you'll find that Michigan tends to be the school they most want to beat - it's true in Illinois and has been true in Iowa.

Part of the reason for my ranking is longevity of the rivalry and the impact on conference standings.

[1OSUNUT]

Don't kid yourself or be arrogant. When you win 6 Big Ten titles in a row - you have a bullseye on you every week. What is bigger game to win one against the champs and a BCS bowl team or a team that has won 8 games total in two years. The Buckeyes get a teams best effort every single week - period. The reason why everybody wants to beat Michigan is A) because of their arrogance and we are better then you attitude B) teams have enjoyed kicking them when they are down.

[tpilews]

Don't kid yourself or be arrogant. When you win 6 Big Ten titles in a row - you have a bullseye on you every week. What is bigger game to win one against the champs and a BCS bowl team or a team that has won 8 games total in two years. The Buckeyes get a teams best effort every single week - period. The reason why everybody wants to beat Michigan is A) because of their arrogance and we are better then you attitude B) teams have enjoyed kicking them when they are down.

Haha, you think people hate tuos because they have a good team??? HAHAHAHA... They hate you because of jackass fans that comprise 90% of the tuos fanbase.

[NorCal Buckeye]

Don't kid yourself or be arrogant. When you win 6 Big Ten titles in a row - you have a bullseye on you every week. What is bigger game to win one against the champs and a BCS bowl team or a team that has won 8 games total in two years. The Buckeyes get a teams best effort every single week - period. The reason why everybody wants to beat Michigan is A) because of their arrogance and we are better then you attitude B) teams have enjoyed kicking them when they are down.

You have that right, Nut. Michigan's historic arrogance is the reason every team in the B10 hates them, and is enjoying the Rodriguez fiasco immensely. As insufferable as Ohio State and it's fans can be, Michigan still beats us out for the most disliked program. Period. Maybe Hawks should weigh in with his opinion on it. With Nebraska I would expect mutual respect between us and them and a good rivalry. With Nebraska and Michigan, I would see the Big Red as wanting to grind them into the turf to make no mistake about it who the better team is, especially with Pellini coaching.

[1OSUNUT]

The difference is Ohio State is not hated - it's just everybody wants to knock off the top team. The Buckeyes are like a bowl game for the teams that will not be attending one. Michigan on the other hand is hated - by everybody. Nobody likes Michigan because they have always thought that they were better then everybody and that they were above all. Based on the last few years we all know that is not true. Michigan used to be the team everybody wanted to knock off (like the evil empire) now they are the team that you don't want to lose to. After all the years of arrogance many are enjoying Michigan's current situation - they are having fun kicking your team while it's down. The Buckeyes are the team that can make another teams season by beating them because they are the top dog. But make no mistake - we have one rival and it's Michigan. That is where all our focus goes and I would not want it any other way. Untill Michigan takes the game as serious as Tressel and the boys do - it will be an uphill battle. Keep thinking you have several rivals.

[Revelli]

The difference is Ohio State is not hated - it's just everybody wants to knock off the top team. The Buckeyes are like a bowl game for the teams that will not be attending one. Michigan on the other hand is hated - by everybody. Nobody likes Michigan because they have always thought that they were better then everybody and that they were above all. Based on the last few years we all know that is not true. Michigan used to be the team everybody wanted to knock off (like the evil empire) now they are the team that you don't want to lose to. After all the years of arrogance many are enjoying Michigan's current situation - they are having fun kicking your team while it's down. The Buckeyes are the team that can make another teams season by beating them because they are the top dog. But make no mistake - we have one rival and it's Michigan. That is where all our focus goes and I would not want it any other way. Untill Michigan takes the game as serious as Tressel and the boys do - it will be an uphill battle. Keep thinking you have several rivals.

Dude, If you really think that, than you are the most ignorant and arrogant person on this site. Everyone in the big 10 + 2 HATES the buckeyes with the white hot passion of one thousand suns. They don't think of you as a bowl game, they think of you the way you think of USC and Michigan. Everyone wants to beat Michigan for bragging rights, to be able to say that they have beaten the most storied program in the history of college football. Ask Penn State who they most want to beat and they'll tell you Michigan because we have consistantly handed Joe-Pa his a$$. Ask those same people who they most respect and they will say the same because of how gracious Michigan fans are. Your focus on Michigan is because Michigan can compete with Ohio State, and while OSU is little more than a football factory, turning out great atheletes with low IQ's, Michigan competes with OSU while still turning out some of the most educated people outside of the ivy league. There is a reason they call Harvard the Michigan of the East.

[1OSUNUT]

One of the most storied programs. If you look at the ESPN rankings for prestige - your below Ohio State. The Buckeyes are the big dog in the conference - the defending champs, 6 times running. Why do you thnk Michigan is hated ? It has nothing to do with what you did in the Civil War days - it's because of your attitudes and arrogance. People like to beat up on Michigan and kick them when they are down - I know us Buckeye fans do. Teams now look at Michigan as a very winable game on the road or at home. You can say what you want about your school but not many of the kids on your team are there for the education. I thought you were called the Harvard of the East because your teams were so close in ability and that both have not been to a bowl game in awhile.

[Wolvrin704]

One of the most storied programs. If you look at the ESPN rankings for prestige - your below Ohio State. The Buckeyes are the big dog in the conference - the defending champs, 6 times running. Why do you thnk Michigan is hated ? It has nothing to do with what you did in the Civil War days - it's because of your attitudes and arrogance. People like to beat up on Michigan and kick them when they are down - I know us Buckeye fans do. Teams now look at Michigan as a very winable game on the road or at home. You can say what you want about your school but not many of the kids on your team are there for the education. I thought you were called the Harvard of the East because your teams were so close in ability and that both have not been to a bowl game in awhile.

The same arrogance you guys accuse UM fans of is exactly why so many people nationwide now hate OSU. Its ok to be amongst the best teams and be proud of it, but so many OSU fans just love to rub it in everyones faces and especially with the now obnoxious use of "The" that makes you guys the absolutely most insufferable and arrogant fans in all CFB. PERIOD.

Yes, teams love to kick us while we're down. DO you not wonder why? It would be the same thing if OSU were to suddenly be in UM's shoes, everyone wants their chance at some come-uppance not so much due to UM arrogance as much as because UM has owned every team in the B10 for so long. When you get a chance to beat them you embellish it and revel in it even if they are bad. Until the past 4 years UM was still a force to be reckoned with in the B10 and as recently as 2 years ago were in the hunt for that conference championship going into the final 2 weeks. When you get to 42 conference championships then come back and talk to us. Don't even try the "you won most of those in the 1800's or before OSU joined", we only won one of those in the 1800's and 5 before OSU joined yet here we are with an 8 win lead and that after OSU has won 5 straight, before that streak it was really ugly same as our win record against OSU.

BTW, you've only won 5 straight conference championships, not 6 and out of those only 3 were outright.

So we've missed a bowl game 2 years straight now, before that it had been 32 years since we had missed a bowl game. Can OSU say the same? No. We will be back to bowling before you know it and to say otherwise is just not looking the facts in the face.

[Blue In Ohio]

Nebraska will be a rivalry just because of 1997. Before they joined we have always gone back and forth with them on which team was better.

OSU is obviously number one. I put MSU at two because they have a history of winning some very controversial games over us and gloating, even though we own them. MSU fans think they are our biggest rival, but they are just dreaming. They really are little brother and everyone knows it. Plus I hate that jackass of a coach they have. I do think they are our number one rival in BB and hockey. ND is number three. Classic football between two teams that I believe are classy programs. Minnesota is fourth just because of the Little Belrown Jug. After that I don't see any rivals in the Big Ten. The Penn St game is always one I look forward to, but I don't think it's a rivalry.

Overall though, nothing compare to the OSU rivalry.

As long as we are down and MSU keeps recruiting as well as it has lately they surely are legitimate competition for us. We really need to have a good season this year to get this thing turned around. Lately MSU has landed some darn good recruits from this state. There was a time when the top 10 players in this state were Michigan's for the taking but constant negative press in this state combined with the fact that we are losing at a time when MSU is not only winning but beating us two years straight gives them a real chance to get some in state players that in years past would have been Michigan all the way. This year is very important. If we drop 3 in a row to them the in state recruiting against them gets worse, unless we win say 8 or 9 games in the season. Not sure why any great football talent would want to choose east lansing over a true football school like Michigan but the press is doing all it can to make MSU look like the more attractive place and some of these recruits are buying it. Michigan once owned the top Detroit talent with Notre Dame sometimes picking up one or two but lately MSU has got some top talent there in Michigan's back yard. Players that in the past would have surely chosen Michigan and could have done alot to help us these coming years. It would be like UC getting top players out of Columbus. We must win this year otherwise we may lose the handle on Detroit. Winning will shut the negative press right down.

[NorCal Buckeye]

What do you BlueBallers think Pellini will think about having his team play Michigan? You know of course that he is a former OSU defensive team captain? Do you think he still has the rivalry in his blood, and is drooling at the thought of putting it to you? Or just another game to him?

[Wolvrin704]

What do you BlueBallers think Pellini will think about having his team play Michigan? You know of course that he is a former OSU defensive team captain? Do you think he still has the rivalry in his blood, and is drooling at the thought of putting it to you? Or just another game to him?

Well duh, of course he is going to want a piece of us. That just gives more credence to Nebraska becoming a rival for UM as well. What exactly are you trying to debate here because the only person I believe who said we wouldn't become rivals was NUT.

[goblue]

I think Nebraska could be a rivalry with Michigan. But if it happens it will happen over time. When I was growing up two of the biggest games in the country were OSU-Mi for the Rose Bowl and Oklahoma-Ne for the Orange Bowl back when it was the Big 8. Nebraska vs Oklahoma was as big as Michigan vs Ohio State. They always played each other in the last game and usually the winner would go to the Orange Bowl. I remember watching those games on tv and the fans of the winning team would always throw oranges out onto the field (Orange Bowl).

As far as I remember Oklahoma and Texas weren't rivals at this time. That changed when Texas joined the Big 8 and it became the Big 12. Nebraska and Oklahoma no longer were rivals and no longer played each other in the last game. Then Oklahoma and Texas became huge rivals. So things can change and anything is possible with rivalries once Nebraska joins the Big 10.

As far as which game is Michigan's biggest rivalry I think depends on where you live. If you live in Michigan, MSU would rank right up there with Ohio State right now. There truly is a hatred between Michigan and MSU as big as Ohio State. I would say more fans around here would even want to see Michigan beat MSU more than OSU. Reason being is MSU and Michigan are about even now, more in-state recruits are going to MSU than Michigan, and someone's got to do something with that jack as s coach they have at MSU. Seriously, Dantonio is about as classless as you can get. Maybe it's just me. But he seems like such a prick. He doesn't win or lose with any grace. He had to make sarcastic comments about Hart's height after they got beat by Michigan. He should have been the bigger man and realized that Hart is a kid and just left it at that after Hart called MSU its little brother. He is the coach after all.

[Revelli]

ESPN has a tendancy to put whoever is doing well at the time, near the top of all its rankings. OSU has been doing very well over the last ten years and your football team and coach should be very proud... BUT YOU'RE NOT PROUD, YOU'RE ARROGANT!! OSU would not even be a part of the big 10 if it wasn't for Michigan and neither would MSU for that matter.

Why do I think Michigan is hated??

I don't think they really are. You are uncapable of seeing that because you're a fan of that school down south, and your (OSU's) entire existence is based on hating Michigan. Do you really think that schools like Texas, USC, Florida, Alabama, etc... hate Michigan? If you do, you're delusional. They view us the same way we view them; a great school with a great football program that we hope we have the skills to beat. That is why we don't respect OSU, you are a crap school with a great football program who are singularly focused on beating our football team, regardless of what you have to do to make that happen. Keith Jackson said it best, "Michigan is an amazing school with an amazing football tradition. OSU is a football factory and they have been trying to catch up to Michigan ever since Michigan got them into the league."

"The Buckeyes are the Big Dogs of the League"

The Buckeyes are A big dog of the league, tied with Michigan, and have been for a while. We are down right now but will be back and that must really bother your ego. Your buckeyes are not the end all-be all of college athletics and that doesn't sit well with you.

You can say what you want about your school but not many of the kids on your team are there for the education.

Ummm.... None of your football players can either. College athletics are to blame, and your petty little comment about bowl games is laughable. We have been bowling way more than you have, and your recent lack of ability to win the big one, is the proof in the pudding.

Do yourself a favor and go fact checking. Look up an independant source, and see where they list OSU academically in the big ten...

[blue in pennsylvania]

Since I live in PA most of my friends are PSU fans and they travel to all the away games. They have said to me on numerous occassions that the trips to Michigan are the best in the big 10 because of how well they are treated not only at the stadium but also around ann arbor. Whether they win or not they always come back from the game saying how classy Michigan fans are. It makes me feel good that my Michigan brothers and sisters give the university such a good name. Now on the other hand they hate going to columbus because of the arrogance of the buckeye fans. They have told me that osu fans throw things at them, cuss at them, and are just plain rude. I am not trying to take a shot at osu fans, just telling you how both fan bases are perceived by a neutral third party.

[Blue In Ohio]

One of the most storied programs. If you look at the ESPN rankings for prestige - your below Ohio State. The Buckeyes are the big dog in the conference - the defending champs, 6 times running. Why do you thnk Michigan is hated ? It has nothing to do with what you did in the Civil War days - it's because of your attitudes and arrogance. People like to beat up on Michigan and kick them when they are down - I know us Buckeye fans do. Teams now look at Michigan as a very winable game on the road or at home. You can say what you want about your school but not many of the kids on your team are there for the education. I thought you were called the Harvard of the East because your teams were so close in ability and that both have not been to a bowl game in awhile.

Right now you are the big dog, but for 20 years Michigan was the big dog and we still lead the series. You have a ways to go.

[Blue In Ohio]

OSU is the biggest rival and for MSU we are their biggest rival due to the fact that we have dominated the series and historically they are little brother which gives them an inferiority complex of hatred. After seeing the pictures of the stadium upgrades I would have to think any football recruit who would choose MSU over UM is just plain dumb. MSU will never be a football power or main destination for top national recruits. What is happening at East Lansing now is probably the best they could ever hope for. 6 to 8 wins and a bowl is the ceiling for MSU. Not sure how that sells better than going to Michigan and playing before one hundred thousand fans and having a shot at winning the conference. MSU might thrive for the moment and get a few in state fools away from us who are sold by the negative press but nationally MSU will never be strong enough to bring in the talent to win the conference or go to a BCS bowl. MSU just has no appeal to the national recruits who see them getting their rears handed to them in every bowl game they play. A few victories over Michigan is a grain of salt in the over all won lost record between rivals. Maybe the coaching staff should sell some of the facts I just mentioned to the few in state fools worth going after that are choosing MSU.

[goblue]

OSU is the biggest rival and for MSU we are their biggest rival due to the fact that we have dominated the series and historically they are little brother which gives them an inferiority complex of hatred. After seeing the pictures of the stadium upgrades I would have to think any football recruit who would choose MSU over UM is just plain dumb. MSU will never be a football power or main destination for top national recruits. What is happening at East Lansing now is probably the best they could ever hope for. 6 to 8 wins and a bowl is the ceiling for MSU. Not sure how that sells better than going to Michigan and playing before one hundred thousand fans and having a shot at winning the conference. MSU might thrive for the moment and get a few in state fools away from us who are sold by the negative press but nationally MSU will never be strong enough to bring in the talent to win the conference or go to a BCS bowl. MSU just has no appeal to the national recruits who see them getting their rears handed to them in every bowl game they play. A few victories over Michigan is a grain of salt in the over all won lost record between rivals. Maybe the coaching staff should sell some of the facts I just mentioned to the few in state fools worth going after that are choosing MSU.

So true what you said. But there is a large MSU fan base in the Detroit area. Why? Many people go to or went to MSU in the Detroit area. Why? 1. It's an easier school to get into. 2. Not to bring stereotype into this. But Michigan does have a reputation of not accepting your typical smart white Christian guy who has the grades to get in - as easily as other nationalities. Asians, Jewish, blacks are known to get in easier.

And I'm not a racist. Just talk to some of the locals around here and you will hear many stories of how your typical Christian, white male wants to go to Michigan, has the grades to get into Michigan, yet are rejected. Many of these rejects then go to MSU instead and end up hating Michigan. I have a nephew who does very well at a private Catholic high school, has the grades to get into Michigan, wants to go into medicine, yet no longer considers Michigan as a college. Why? He said only 3 out of 15 students at his school that apply to Michigan that have the grades and s.a.t. scores to get in, will get in. Therefore, he's considering MSU or Wayne State. This is unfortunate. But I've heard this same type of story over and over and over from good credible people.