Why Catholics are evil.

[RealSchool]

When they aren't molesting young boys, Catholics like to make the aids crisis worse by their outdated opinions.

http://news.aol.com/article/pope-condoms-aids/384211


The Pope is evil.

[chriswebber]

Do you hate white people too? Just because you do not agree with someone's viewpoint does not make it outdated. To be honesty, if you didn't have sex with everyone you met, you would be less likely to get AIDS. That's not an idea, that is what we call common sense. What's next, you'll find an article stating looking both ways before crossing the road is outdated?

[amazinblue]

Do you think that Pope John Paul II contributed to the fall of Communism (in Russia)?

[GoDeepHammer]

When they aren't molesting young boys, Catholics like to make the aids crisis worse by their outdated opinions.

http://news.aol.com/article/pope-condoms-aids/384211


The Pope is evil.

This is a stupid post with a link that doesn't work. Why would you lump all Catholics into one group, that just shows your ignorace.

I am Catholic, never had to worry about young boys, I do agree that their form of birth control is a lot outdated, but there are a lot of good qualities in being Catholic and the teachings.

[osusteve]

I do have a problem with Pope John Paul II going to Mexico and telling all the uneducated masses to continue to have children and not use birth control.

It is outrageous that Mexico City, with approximately 30 million people, has a larger population than the the entire country of Canada.

[amazinblue]

I do have a problem with Pope John Paul II going to Mexico and telling all the uneducated masses to continue to have children and not use birth control.

It is outrageous that Mexico City, with approximately 30 million people, has a larger population than the the entire country of Canada.

osusteve,

I agree that the Catholic Church's stance on contraception is not "aligned" with the advances of society. And, that family planning practices can be very helpful in controlling numerous things - one of which is a population growth / explosion. And, the use of "safe sex" practices can be very effective in controlling the spread of STD's / HIV / AIDS.

I don't agree with the Church's stance on this. And, the Catholic Church has a history of "not being nice" - in such periods as The Crusades, or The Inquisition.

There's a saying that it takes a while to turn an aircraft carrier around - and, I'm certainly not implying that the Catholic Church is going to change its opinions / stance on certain issues. However, to assume that there has been "no worth" provided by them is, IMO, not fair either.

I credit John Paul II for standing up to communism, beliefs and actions that began when he was a priest in Krakow and continued as his position escalated. I do believe that he helped fuel a belief in the spirit of people, and their feedom. The activities associated with the Solidarity movement helped exemplify this.

So, like anything - there are good and bad things. The Catholic Church is no exception.

And - RealSchool - I'm sure you've got some interesting things to say about Mother Teresa as well...

[Mike Furley]

Real School.

You are a terribly uninformed person and wholly ignorant of Catholic theology. I suggest you read Love & Responsibility by Karol Wojtyla before attacking Catholicism and the Pope.

Here's a primer:



* We are all called by God to love everybody.

* Marriage is a Sacrament and an institution that deserves our respect and support. It is viewed as a Sacrament because it signifies God's presence in the union of husband & wife.

* Marriage is not something that should be entered into lightly. It should only be embraced by two people whose love for one another is one of a mutual self-giving. A relationship built merely upon a friendship of pleasure or friendship of utility is one that is not of the highest order. They are not considered to be of the highest order because they will eventually erode once the pleasure or utility cease to exist. Read Aristotle's Nichomachean Ethics if you don't understand this concept.

* Sexual intercourse is a physical expression of a couple's mutual self-giving love. It should be confined solely to within the institution of marriage, and it should always allow for the possibility of conception. Sexual intercourse that does not occur within the institution of marriage and does not allow for the possibility of conception ultimately devolves to utilitarian principles of mere pleasure seeking and the use of another's body to meet those ends. That type of sexual intercourse diminishes the personhood of one or both participants. Each individual has an incommunicable self-worth and must always be respected in both our words and actions.

* In-Vitro fertilization distorts God's presence in our participation in the miracle of life and contraceptives prevents the possibility of conception. Both should be avoided.




Hence, it is entirely consistent with our theology and the catechism of the Catholic Church for the Pope to state that HIV/AIDS must be combatted by means other than those that are in opposition to our faith. If sexual intercourse is soley confined to within a marriage, the spread of HIV/AIDS would be drastically reduced to an infinitely small number.

I beg you to cease with further vitriolic posts targeted at Catholics, Catholicism, and the Pope. If you'd like to have a mature discussion regarding Catholic theology, then I will be happy to participate if my knowledge is sufficient to provide helpful answers.

God Bless,

Mike Furley

[bigboyBlue]

osusteve,

I agree that the Catholic Church's stance on contraception is not "aligned" with the advances of society. And, that family planning practices can be very helpful in controlling numerous things - one of which is a population growth / explosion. And, the use of "safe sex" practices can be very effective in controlling the spread of STD's / HIV / AIDS.

I don't agree with the Church's stance on this. And, the Catholic Church has a history of "not being nice" - in such periods as The Crusades, or The Inquisition.

There's a saying that it takes a while to turn an aircraft carrier around - and, I'm certainly not implying that the Catholic Church is going to change its opinions / stance on certain issues. However, to assume that there has been "no worth" provided by them is, IMO, not fair either.

I credit John Paul II for standing up to communism, beliefs and actions that began when he was a priest in Krakow and continued as his position escalated. I do believe that he helped fuel a belief in the spirit of people, and their feedom. The activities associated with the Solidarity movement helped exemplify this.

So, like anything - there are good and bad things. The Catholic Church is no exception.

And - RealSchool - I'm sure you've got some interesting things to say about Mother Teresa as well...

Basically you're saying some of the teachings are dated...and I agree, you cannot follow centuries old scriptures verbatim. Other than teaching a few timeless essentials (truthfulness, honesty, etc) most religions don't address the internet, embryonic stem cell research, and bailouts. Maybe we need new ones... Scientology anyone?

[amazinblue]

Basically you're saying some of the teachings are dated...and I agree, you cannot follow centuries old scriptures verbatim. Other than teaching a few timeless essentials (truthfulness, honesty, etc) most religions don't address the internet, embryonic stem cell research, and bailouts. Maybe we need new ones... Scientology anyone?

BBB,

Whoa.... let's not get carried away... Scientology? It's a very interesting thing - I've worked on contracts with some multi-national companies, and an interesting clause some of them have (primarily those firms based out of Germany) - is whether Scientologist "followers" are allowed to be part of the project teams. This issue creates huge challenges for those (like me) who believe in religious freedom.

I think the challenge facing the Catholic Church really is rooted in how teachings are applied to society today. The theology and fundamental tenets, IMO, need to apply to a society that is much different than it was 50, 100, 500, or 2,000 years ago.

You mentioned stem cell research - and, it's one of those topics that should be very thought provoking and approached cautiously. I believe that every expecting parent should look into saving umbilical cord blood of their children. I don't know the true potential that it could have in the future, but - if it can help save a child recover from a severe illness - I find it hard to believe that our maker wouldn't welcome it - something to save one of God's creatures from ill and harm.

It would be impossible to put the Genie back in the bottle after certain discoveries are made - and, relying on individual ethics and conscience can't be the only way to ensure certain boundaries aren't crossed. Now, what should that boundary be - that's certainly a topic for another thread...

[amazinblue]

Furley,

What a fine post! I think that there may be some challenges with what you've written, since the books you've referenced are longer than the 500 word limit that RealSchool seems to live by...

[RealSchool]

http://www.cnn.com/2009/POLITICS/03/18/martin.condoms/index.html

A fine article based in the reality of today's world. I spent 6 months in Africa. Have any of you even left the midwest oh wise ones?

[chriswebber]

Oh yeah, your 6 months in africa makes you a scholar. Let me put it to you easily. As half my family is african as in they own houses both here and then and speak 3 languages, the only way to absolutely positively avoid aids is to not have sex or blood contact with someone who has the disease. Yes, you have to show self control. It requires maturity. If Aids is such a big problem in your life, please donate your 144k salary to an Aids mission in Africa. You can either cure a disease or remove it, see polio. You're dense and probably 17.

[The Michigan Man]

When they aren't molesting young boys, Catholics like to make the aids crisis worse by their outdated opinions.

http://news.aol.com/article/pope-condoms-aids/384211


The Pope is evil.

You certainly are a master baiter...

[RealSchool]

Real School.

You are a terribly uninformed person and wholly ignorant of Catholic theology. I suggest you read Love & Responsibility by Karol Wojtyla before attacking Catholicism and the Pope.

Here's a primer.

We are all called by God to love everybody.

Marriage is a Sacrament and an institution that deserves our support. It signifies God's presence in the union of man & wife.

Marriage is not something that should be entered into lightly. It should be embraced by two people whose love for one another is one of mutual self-giving. A relationship built upon merely a friendship of pleasure or utility is one that is of not the highest order. Read Aristotle's Nichomachean Ethics if you don't understand this.

Sexual intercourse is an expression of a couple's mutual self-giving love, should be confined within the institution of marriage, and should always allow for the possibility of conception. Sexual intercourse that does not occur within the institution of marriage and does not allow for the possibility of conception then devolves to utilitarian principles of mere pleasure seeking and the use of another's body to meet these ends. This type of sexual intercourse diminishes the personhood of one or both participants. Each individual has an incommunicable worth and must always be respected in our words and actions.

In-Vitro fertilization and contraception either distorts God's presence in our participation in the miracle of life and creating a new life or prevents the possibility of conception. Both should be avoided.

Hence, it is entirely consistent with our theology and catechism for the Pope to state that HIV/AIDS must be combatted with means other than those that are opposed to our catechism. If sexual intercourse were confined to marriage, the spread of HIV/AIDS would be drastically reduced to an infinitely small number.

I beg you to cease with further vitriolic posts targeted at Catholics, Catholicism, and the Pope. If you'd like to have a mature discussion regarding Catholic theology, then I will be happy to participate when my knowledge is sufficient to provide helpful answers. In the future, you may wish to first read up on something before lambasting it.

God Bless,

Mike Furley


My questions for you after reading this:

*Are you unmarried? If so are you a virgin?
*If you are married do you only have sex for the purpose of conception?
*Have you ever masterbated?

With your belief that aids can be solved in Africa by following catholic teachings one can only assume that you follow every rule as well.

[RealSchool]

Oh yeah, your 6 months in africa makes you a scholar. Let me put it to you easily. As half my family is african as in they own houses both here and then and speak 3 languages, the only way to absolutely positively avoid aids is to not have sex or blood contact with someone who has the disease. Yes, you have to show self control. It requires maturity. If Aids is such a big problem in your life, please donate your 144k salary to an Aids mission in Africa. You can either cure a disease or remove it, see polio. You're dense and probably 17.

How well has self control worked dumbass when 23 million people have aids in Africa? Sexual desire will always trump catholic teachings. I mean look at how many kids were molested within the church. You live in a bubble. For the sake of becoming a better chriswebber, please travel.

[RealSchool]

Furley,

What a fine post! I think that there may be some challenges with what you've written, since the books you've referenced are longer than the 500 word limit that RealSchool seems to live by...


And yet you write this in another post "I agree that the Catholic Church's stance on contraception is not "aligned" with the advances of society."

So what is it amazinblue? Fine post but you don't agree with it? Get back to your cubicle, this is above your pay grade.

[amazinblue]

And yet you write this in another post "I agree that the Catholic Church's stance on contraception is not "aligned" with the advances of society."

So what is it amazinblue? Fine post but you don't agree with it? Get back to your cubicle, this is above your pay grade.

RealSchool,

I don't have to agree with someone's opinion to conclude the points they make are fair and valid. Our government, IMO, is based on compromise - two or more parties reaching an agreement that benefits the citizens of our country. The problem with our government lately (perhaps over the last 15 years) has been the reluctance or inability to listen to the other sides position and draft / pass appropriate legislation.

There's a big difference between discussing a difference of opinions, and blatantly following those expressed by others simply because "you want to belong." My guess is that you're a huge advocate for and follower of Nancy Pelosi.

Every person in this country has the freedom to decide what, if any, faith they will follow. Religious freedom is one thing that our country provides that certain other countries don't. If you disagree with the theology of the Catholic Church, then it's your right to follow the teachings of another religion.

I'm sure that you're an advocate and supporter of the Right to Privacy. Unfortunately, no such Right is described either in the Bill of Rights or The US Constitution. So, what are you really a supporter of?

[Mike Furley]

My questions for you after reading this:

*Are you unmarried? If so are you a virgin?
*If you are married do you only have sex for the purpose of conception?
*Have you ever masterbated?

With your belief that aids can be solved in Africa by following catholic teachings one can only assume that you follow every rule as well.

Real School,

It seems like you strive for cogent profundity in your arguments but you never seem quite able to surpass clever superficiality. Its quite remarkable.

The existence of objective moral standards and articles of faith does not hinge on adherence to them; nor does the failure to adhere to them preclude one from acknowledging said existence of the moral standards and articles of faith.



* A human being possesses human nature.

* Human nature consists, in part, of rational thought, animalistic desires, sympathy, and free will.

* One's free will allows one to choose an action that may not adhere to an objective moral standard and article of faith.

* This action is still, nonetheless, a moral failure committed by the agent.

* One's action does not mean that one lacks the rational ability to recognize that one has committed a moral failure.

* Recognition of a moral failure is what allows for one to then have compunction.

* A feeling of compunction allows one to seek forgiveness from and make amends with the aggrieved - be it with one's self, another person, God, or all of the above.


Under no circumstance does any of the above preclude, retard, or restrict one from acknowldging, anunciating, and sharing a belief system possessing objective moral standards and articles of faith.


In the linked story of the original post, the Pope was anunciating the beliefs of the religion he leads. He has no legal controlling authority. His words cannot prevent goverenmental and secular organizations from doing whatever they so choose.

Why his expression of faith should elicit such ire from you causes me to speculate there is something deeper that vexes you. Based on the various posts you have submitted, I have surmised the following:

You do not believe a judgment can be severed by a person unless that person has consistently and unfailingly experienced everything related to the subject of the judgment. Given human nature and the limitations of time and money, virtually no human being could possibly be qualified to render any judgments on any subject. Hence, no judgments can exist in this world.

I further surmise that at some point in your life you committed an action, stated a personal belief, or participated in a lifestyle whereupon afterwards a parent, authority figure, peer, or stranger judged your action, belief, or lifestyle to be wrong or to be a moral failure of some kind - and you did not like that experience.

You most likely felt "who are you to judge me?"

Perhaps you were entirely justified in feeling this way if the person rendering the judgment was, in fact, judging you.

Perhaps too, the person wasn't rendering a judgment on you, but rather was making a judgment about the action, belief, lifestyle - but failed to adequately articulate the distinction between you as a person and the action as an event.

Or still, the person did articulate the distinction between you as a person and the action as an event, but you are unable to divorce the action from you because you allow the action to define you.

Regardless of how it unfolded, and whether you choose to acknowledge it or not, and whether you like it or not - subjective judgments of objective moral standards do exist in this world. If others do not share your subjective judgments, you have every right to try and persuade them to see your point of view through use of the dialectic method.



As to your questions regarding me, I will share with you that I am married - and because I am married, I have an obligation to my spouse to keep certain aspects of our marriage sacred and private. I will say however that I wish I had been exposed to the wonderfully uplifting words found in Wojtyla's Love and Responsibility prior to adolescence, and especially so prior to moving off to college. I was fortunate to have parents willing to teach me sexual education and a school system that tought me sexual health education - both valuable subjects. What was absent though was any education regarding sexual ethics and the nature of love; and the responsibility associated with those two subjects. I have personal regret for some of my actions. I would like to see as many people as possible avoid those same feelings of regret - thus I shared with you some ideas I hold dear, and ones you flippantly used to attempt to score a message board point.

The Pope is likewise trying to persuade others as well. Contempt by you for his choosing to exercise his universal freedom of speech is a judgment by you, and a poor one at that.

[byebyelloyd]

Real School.

You are a terribly uninformed person and wholly ignorant of Catholic theology. I suggest you read Love & Responsibility by Karol Wojtyla before attacking Catholicism and the Pope.

Here's a primer:



* We are all called by God to love everybody.

* Marriage is a Sacrament and an institution that deserves our respect and support. It is viewed as a Sacrament because it signifies God's presence in the union of husband & wife.

* Marriage is not something that should be entered into lightly. It should only be embraced by two people whose love for one another is one of a mutual self-giving. A relationship built merely upon a friendship of pleasure or friendship of utility is one that is not of the highest order. They are not considered to be of the highest order because they will eventually erode once the pleasure or utility cease to exist. Read Aristotle's Nichomachean Ethics if you don't understand this concept.

* Sexual intercourse is a physical expression of a couple's mutual self-giving love. It should be confined solely to within the institution of marriage, and it should always allow for the possibility of conception. Sexual intercourse that does not occur within the institution of marriage and does not allow for the possibility of conception ultimately devolves to utilitarian principles of mere pleasure seeking and the use of another's body to meet those ends. That type of sexual intercourse diminishes the personhood of one or both participants. Each individual has an incommunicable self-worth and must always be respected in both our words and actions.

* In-Vitro fertilization distorts God's presence in our participation in the miracle of life and contraceptives prevents the possibility of conception. Both should be avoided.




Hence, it is entirely consistent with our theology and the catechism of the Catholic Church for the Pope to state that HIV/AIDS must be combatted by means other than those that are in opposition to our faith. If sexual intercourse is soley confined to within a marriage, the spread of HIV/AIDS would be drastically reduced to an infinitely small number.

I beg you to cease with further vitriolic posts targeted at Catholics, Catholicism, and the Pope. If you'd like to have a mature discussion regarding Catholic theology, then I will be happy to participate if my knowledge is sufficient to provide helpful answers.

God Bless,

Mike Furley

whats the catholics 11th commandment, thou shalt sweep under the rug or change the rules as neccessary? catholics showed their hands in the whole molestation scandal, no action, only smoke and mirrors. its sick and thankfully opened the eyes of people who never thought to question such a flawed religion.

[Mike Furley]

whats the catholics 11th commandment, thou shalt sweep under the rug or change the rules as neccessary? catholics showed their hands in the whole molestation scandal, no action, only smoke and mirrors. its sick and thankfully opened the eyes of people who never thought to question such a flawed religion.

I, as a Catholic, was terribly troubled by the aforementioned abuse and even more troubled by the way some dioceses tried to address the abuse by sweeping it under the rug.

That being said, I have little difficulty in divorcing the message from the messenger.

The message is universal, enduring and one worthy of worship. The messengers are provincial and mere temporary stewards of the offices they hold.

I wish they would have the respect for the positions they hold and the perspective to recognize that as temporary stewards their actions can detract from the message for those who cannot divorce the message from the messenger.

[gator]

Hey guys,

Guess I'm a little late getting into this one, but thought I would put my two cents in because some serious ideas are being discussed here. First, I'm Baptist, not Catholic. Hence, there are serious differences in their views and mine. For instance, praying to saints boarders on idolatry and blasphemy in my personal opinion because I feel you are worshipping someone who is not God. When Jesus proclaimed the Lord's Prayer, it started, "Our Father who art in heaven." Just always made sense to me that you should pray to the Big Guy directly. Another thing I've heard that Catholics believe is that you have to be part of the "Church" in order to be saved instead of simply confessing Jesus as your Lord and Saviour. When I say confess, I mean heart-felt with a real change in your life, not just in a passing sense like we are so aften exposed to with our primetime athletes. I just don't think God will hold it against you if your aren't in perfect standing with a church comprised of fallible people; I mean church leaders have certainly shown their capacity for error in the past, and nobody is perfect except God. Finally, the abuse scandal was an abomination. I think those responsible will have a special place in hell not only because of what they did, but because they should have been the last people to hurt children. Mind you, that these are my thoughts, based on my own understanding of the Bible; I'm not even speaking on behalf of other Baptist.

With that being said, I don't see the purpose of throwing the baby out with the bath water. I think there are many fine Catholics who believe Jesus is the Lord and Saviour, and they are saved. Further, why do some people just hate religion. Even if you don't share their views on birth control, abortion, marital sex only, etc; you must admit that most tenets they live by (or should live by) make them a better person IMO. I have to ask what's wrong with not killing, honoring thy father and mother, not taking the Lord's name in vain, not coveting, not cheating on your wife, telling the truth, loving thy neighbor as thyself, and putting God number 1? What's always funny to me is that so many in our country seem to hate Christians, but don't seem to have near as strong of an opinion about Islam. Now there's a winner. A bible that proclaims killing the infidel by cutting off their heads - hate over love, I think. Even with that, some Muslim's are peace-loving people and I don't have a single problem with them. I don't personally think they will be saved, but as long as they aren't out on a Holy War to kill people, their religion can help them strive to be respectable and productive people. What's wrong with that?

Finally, on the topic of being outdated: My aunt has done mission work in Africa for years and has told me what I think is the most outdated belief and a significant cause in the spread of AIDS in Africa. Many villagers in Africa think that the only way one with AIDS can get rid of it is to have sex with a virgin. Now surely, even the most biased person can see more merit in the Catholic plan than that complete falsehood. When you get right down to it, the Catholic (Christian) plan for HIV, although tough to live by, would actually work if everyone followed it. There really is no arguing that. Moreover, it's also the moral thing to do. That is why us conservatives prefer to view things as right and wrong, black and white, because we actually see the sense and benefit of living by Gods commandments. Of course, none of us are perfect and we've all sinned at some point, but that's the beauty in Jesus's testimony: He died so that we would not pay the wages of our own sin, the death of our soul. There's always a chance to make it right with God before you die. I guess that's why so many conservative are born-again Christians; they associate with a message of hope and can do.

P.S. Why was RealSchool determined to cast shame on Mike with personal questions of sin? I guess he feels if he can show fault in those that believe these principles then we have no grounds for advocating them. What RealSchool doesn't understand is that being a Christian doesn't mean you are without sin. At it's essence, being a Christian is recognizing that you are a sinner and in need of God's forgiveness, which only comes through the sacrifice of Jesus Christ. Although we strive to follow them, the true purpose of the ten commandments is to show you that you are not without sin.

[Medic]

When they aren't molesting young boys, Catholics like to make the aids crisis worse by their outdated opinions.

http://news.aol.com/article/pope-condoms-aids/384211


The Pope is evil.

Your post is disgusting, ignorant, and foolish. Not to mention unworthy of the time people are taking to actually engage you in discussion.

I feel sorry for you.

[RealSchool]

Your post is disgusting, ignorant, and foolish. Not to mention unworthy of the time people are taking to actually engage you in discussion.

I feel sorry for you.



You feel disgusted? So do I. Everything I wrote is spot on, sorry your PC attitude can not see past that. Have Catholics molested young boys? Was it covered up by the church? Do you give a shit about that or is it beyond wrong to question the church in your view? The Catholic church is to blame for so much suffering and yet you are more angry with a person like me for pointing that out then what they have done.

So my question to you is, where in the fuck are your morals?

[Wolvrin704]

You feel disgusted? So do I. Everything I wrote is spot on, sorry your PC attitude can not see past that. Have Catholics molested young boys? Was it covered up by the church? Do you give a shit about that or is it beyond wrong to question the church in your view? The Catholic church is to blame for so much suffering and yet you are more angry with a person like me for pointing that out then what they have done.

So my question to you is, where in the fuck are your morals?

White men are more likely to be serial killers than women or minorities. Should all white men be considered evil serial killers?

[Mike Furley]

You feel disgusted? So do I. Everything I wrote is spot on, sorry your PC attitude can not see past that. Have Catholics molested young boys? Was it covered up by the church? Do you give a shit about that or is it beyond wrong to question the church in your view? The Catholic church is to blame for so much suffering and yet you are more angry with a person like me for pointing that out then what they have done.

So my question to you is, where in the fuck are your morals?

Straight from Alinsky's playbook. RealSchool parrots Alinsky's 4th rule:

"Make the enemy live up to their own book of rules. You can kill them with this, for they can no more obey their own rules than the Christian church can live up to Christianity"



RealSchool's unoriginal and vapid sophistry again shines more of a light upon his own ignorance than it does anything else. For his edification, I put forth the following:

Our Father, who art in Heaven,
Hallowed be they name.
Thy kingdom come,
Thy will be done
On earth as it is in Heaven.
Give us this day our daily bread,
and forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those who trespass against us
And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil.




The heart of Christianity is the recognition that we are all sinners and that because of the sacrifice of Jesus Christ who died for our sins, we may receive eternal salvation. With the use of our God-given intellect and the blessing of God's grace, we can hope and strive to avoid sin. Nevertheless, we are all still sinners.


The terrible mistakes committed by some priests, and the response by some dioceses were sinful errors; grave, mortal sins. Nonetheless, we are called to exercise forgiveness if the individuals in question are truly repentant of their behavior.




As for the other 98% of Catholic priests and dioceses that did not engage in this sinful behavior, we continue to be thankful for their great work in teaching people about Christ, feeding the hungry, clothing the impoverished, and sheltering the homeless.

Or maybe we should tell them to stop, eh RealSchool?



I am not deceived. Marxists believe the state should provide all direction and command all services. Therefore there should be no institutions that can compete with it. If the playing field is leveled of its competition, the only thing left is the state.

Hence, if the Catholic Church can be brought down by the disenguous bastardized arguments of twits like RealSchool, its one less competitor for the state. The Left views institutions like the Catholic Church as an enemy that is consuming dollars that otherwise should be directed to the state.

That's really what bothers people like RealSchool. They see all of the millions of dollars people willingly contribute to the Church and are pissed that its not going to the state. Eliminate the church and those dollars can flow to the state.



It's amazing just how similar the Left's bashing of Christianity and the Catholic Church parrots the rhetoric of the Nazi's against the Jews.

Great intellectual company you keep RealSchool.

[Wolvrin704]

That's really what bothers people like RealSchool. They see all of the millions of dollars people willingly contribute to the Church and are pissed that its not going to the state. Eliminate the church and those dollars can flow to the state.


I am a Protestant but also into history and I quoted this line because it reminds me of someone else who thought the very same thing.........Henry VIII. That was part of his reason for leaving Rome, so he could control the English church and ultimately benefit from their income. Of course at the time the church was the largest landowner in England.

There are many other people in history who did far more to gain control of church income but this is the one that jumps out at me most.

[RealSchool]

"It's amazing just how similar the Left's bashing of Christianity and the Catholic Church parrots the rhetoric of the Nazi's against the Jews."


Do you really want to go there Furley? Considering the Pope is a German "former" Nazi I would pick your words better next time.

[Mike Furley]

"It's amazing just how similar the Left's bashing of Christianity and the Catholic Church parrots the rhetoric of the Nazi's against the Jews."


Do you really want to go there Furley? Considering the Pope is a German "former" Nazi I would pick your words better next time.




Let's go there.

He was a teenager in Germany during the 3rd Reiche. It was compulsory for him and every other teenaged boy of his age to be enrolled in the Hitler Youth Corpe. He left the first opportunity he got.

But for the sake of your pettiness and or ignorance, let's assume he was the guy actually gassing innocent Jews. Again, if he was repentant for his sins, the "cult" of Christianity believes God would forgive him, and we would similarly be called to do the same.

I wait with baited breath for your next ignorant and sophomoric jest.

[chriswebber]

Let's go there.

He was a teenager in Germany during the 3rd Reiche. It was compulsory for him and every other teenaged boy of his age to be enrolled in the Hitler Youth Corpe. He left the first opportunity he got.

But for the sake of your pettiness and or ignorance, let's assume he was the guy actually gassing innocent Jews. Again, if he was repentant for his sins, the "cult" of Christianity believes God would forgive him, and we would similarly be called to do the same.

I wait with baited breath for your next ignorant and sophomoric jest.

Now that we're there I guess Obama's friends can come into play now... :rolleyes:

[Mike Furley]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/france/5345389/Carla-Bruni-criticises-Pope-Benedict-XVI.html

I take some satisfaction in knowing the person holding the opposite position of me thinks Africa is a country. Check out her bio on wikipedia. She's a pegboard for the rich & famous

[gator]

You feel disgusted? So do I. Everything I wrote is spot on, sorry your PC attitude can not see past that. Have Catholics molested young boys? Was it covered up by the church? Do you give a shit about that or is it beyond wrong to question the church in your view? The Catholic church is to blame for so much suffering and yet you are more angry with a person like me for pointing that out then what they have done.

So my question to you is, where in the fuck are your morals?

I thought Medic's analysis was spot on. Since he didn't come out and advocate the molesting of young children, I'm going to go way out on a limb and predict that Medic is probably just as disgusted as the next person about the abuse of children at the hands of the Church. I think that's a fair statement. If his opinion is disgust, like yours, where is the differentiation between your morals and his, which you happen to criticize. I don't think Medic, or anyone else here, is angry with someone pointing out these cruelties or even the fallibility of Church leaders. What makes your post disgusting is the utter contempt and trashing of the Church (and basically Christians in general), as if criminal acts were all they are capable of doing. I would dare say, that Christian missions and charity bring more aid (not AIDS) to impoverished populations around the world than any other organization, cause, or movement. It seems like we are always giving to one charity or another at church (on top of tithe), but still people dig deep (even in this economy) to help the less fortunate. However, you never acknowledge a single good thing brought about through religion. I'll bet you've never seen an alcholic, abusive husband and/or father, druggie, philanderer, criminal, or anyone else of otherwise negative disposition turn their life around though the hope and power of Christ. Those kinds of things happen everyday throughout the world and have exponential benefits to all those interacting with those individuals. No, you would much rather insinuate that the Catholic church likes to molest children, hopes to spread AIDS, and is being lead by a closet Nazi.

Although you disagree with the Catholic stance on AIDS, your claim that their policy spreads the disease is outrageous. If people actually refrained from sexual activity, except in marriage, AIDS would tramatically decrease. At worst you can declare the plan a failure, but don't act like Christians are hoping to spread AIDS. The Church would have to advocate unrestrained, unprotected sexual orgies (which happens to be more of a liberal mindset) before you could accurately accuse them of that. I kind of liken the Pope's AIDS plan to liberals' ideas of socialism and communism: great in theory (at least for those that don't want to be individuals), but a failure in practice (you always get a Hitler, Stalin, Castro because dissent is not allowed and people in power will abuse their power). Unless I'm mistaken, the Pope's plan doesn't keep anyone from getting a condem by force of law; condoms just won't be advocated or provided by church organizations, right? When did it becomes the Church's responsibility to make sure everyone in Africa uses a condem.

As far as the Pope being a Nazi, you just make me want to vomit sometimes. You may question our morals, but nobody here is under the illusion that you have any class. I saw a History Channel program on Valkyrie the other night, and they mentioned that you could be executed just for failing to salute Hitler. I imagine anyone refusing Hitler's Youth Corp wouldn't exactly win a weekend getaway. I don't personally fault him for joining, but I'm sure you, being of much higher moral standard and class, would have told Hitler to go F himself. Saying that he was a Nazi, without any proof that he was actively involved is like saying one of those young, molested Catholic boys is a homosexual although he grows up, gets married, has children, and never has consentual sex with a man.

RealSchool, maybe you should try going to a church before you bash them for everything they are worth. My guess is that you would be astounded by the generosity and outreach of the people. If you are going to church, please find one that isn't pastored by Jeramiah Wright.