QB Power rankings

[Wolvrin704]

Found this interesting tidbit on Rivals, they have listed the top QB's in the nation and understandably no UM guys on there but where oh where is Mr TP?

1. Tim Tebow
2. Sam Bradford
3. Colt McCoy
4. Zac Robinson
5. Todd Reesing
6. Daryll Clark
7. Jevan Snead
8. Case Keenum
9. Dan Lefevour
10. Max Hall
11. Robert Griffin
12. Jeremiah Masoli
13. Russell Wilson
14. Jimmy Clausen
15. Tim Hiller
16. Terrell Pryor

How far the mighty have fallen. Just a year ago he was the next great one and even this year Don has all but christened him as a Heisman candidate sure to be in the top 5 in voting. Yet here he sits rated as the 16th best QB in all college football behind 2 MAC guys and Jimmy Claussen. Oh the shame of it all!

[1OSUNUT]

WE will see where he is ranked come the mid point of the season. If the Buckeyes beat Michigan we very well could be playing for the NC with our 16th ranked QB.

[The Michigan Man]

If the Buckeyes beat Michigan we very well could be playing for the NC with our 16th ranked QB.

"If"? That is the first time I've heard anything less than absolute certainty from the trolls about a tUOS win over Michigan this year...interesting.

As far as the NC game, the country is still very sour on tUOS after the last 2 NC blowouts, so anything less than an undefeated season would make it very difficult for them to get voted in.

[1OSUNUT]

My bad I mean USC. We will beat Michigan - thats a given.

[byebyelloyd]

My bad I mean USC. We will beat Michigan - thats a given.

wow, the fucking pussy shows a sliver of reality in a post knowing tressel can't defend the spread and pryor still can't throw and then tries to backtrack, nice try pussy.

[Wolvrin704]

My bad I mean USC. We will beat Michigan - thats a given.

You've got allot more roadblocks this season than USC. The rest of the Big Ten is starting to catch up.

[1OSUNUT]

How do you figure they are catching up ? The Buckeyes have out recruited every team in the conference for years and posted some of the best classes in the nation the last three years. How are they catching up - please tell me. To catch up means that you have to out recxruit us and have more experience then us - you have neither. The Buckeyes have a rock solid defense returning and a incredibly talented QB for the next three years. Who is catching us ? Please don't tell me Michigan with their horrible defense and freshman QB.

[Wolvrin704]

How do you figure they are catching up ? The Buckeyes have out recruited every team in the conference for years and posted some of the best classes in the nation the last three years. How are they catching up - please tell me. To catch up means that you have to out recxruit us and have more experience then us - you have neither. The Buckeyes have a rock solid defense returning and a incredibly talented QB for the next three years. Who is catching us ? Please don't tell me Michigan with their horrible defense and freshman QB.

I'm sorry recruiting = winning. We all give up since you out recruited us.

You keep talking out of both sids of your mouth. Now you're saying OSU has more experience than anyone else and in another thread you tried to claim OSU was the youngest team in the conference. Make up your mind. When you do maybe we can talk.

I do recall you guys have lost to Illinois and Penn Stat ein the last 2 seasons so they are starting to catch up. UM is not far behind in recruiting and several other schools aren't far behind either. You think being on top is going to last forever?

[1OSUNUT]

Wow we lost to Illinois and Penn State in two seasons. Both were BCS teams with some pretty good NFL talent. How good was Illinois last year after they lost Medenhall ? The Buckeyes win a vast majority of the games that they are supposed to. I much rather lose to Illinois and Penn State then to Notre Dame, Toledo, App State and teams of that caliber. How do you know Michigan is catching up. Your coming off the worst season in history and have not seen them play this year. So how do you know ?

Ohio State is very young - but they also have experience. JT does a great job of getting young kids playing time. The defense returns underclassmen that have played in big games and a BCS bowl. The offense has a nice mixture of freshman and sophmores as well as guys who have played. Like it or not Boren will help (he was the best you had) this year and the WR's will be a HUGE surprise. We have experience at RB as well. All is good in Buckeye land. We know we are going to be good. Michigan on the other hand - the jury is out. How come on the other post when asked what game Michigan will win for sure nobody picked the opener ? Nobody picked that Michigan would destroy Westerm Michigan - at home.

Because you guys don't know. Your the mighty Wolverines with all these top knotch recruits and your incredible coach (who was your 4th choice) along with Barwis, etc - and nobody went out on the ledge to say we are going to beat Western ? That does not sound liek a team catching up. You fans won't admit it but your nervous. You don't know how this year will turn out or how Tate will play when it counts. You also have zero confidence in your defense. So don't try to pass your Kool-Aid on me that Michigan is catching up - because eben you guys are not sure thats the case. Your just praying that they are at this point.

[rickyleach]

this is old news. but to be honest with you im surprised pryor is ranked this high, even though he is a soph ,he is a has been wanna be qb, tate will be a better qb then him ,he might not beable to run like pryor but he will play the position better..

[Wolvrin704]

Wow we lost to Illinois and Penn State in two seasons. Both were BCS teams with some pretty good NFL talent. How good was Illinois last year after they lost Medenhall ? The Buckeyes win a vast majority of the games that they are supposed to. I much rather lose to Illinois and Penn State then to Notre Dame, Toledo, App State and teams of that caliber. How do you know Michigan is catching up. Your coming off the worst season in history and have not seen them play this year. So how do you know ?

Ohio State is very young - but they also have experience. JT does a great job of getting young kids playing time. The defense returns underclassmen that have played in big games and a BCS bowl. The offense has a nice mixture of freshman and sophmores as well as guys who have played. Like it or not Boren will help (he was the best you had) this year and the WR's will be a HUGE surprise. We have experience at RB as well. All is good in Buckeye land. We know we are going to be good. Michigan on the other hand - the jury is out. How come on the other post when asked what game Michigan will win for sure nobody picked the opener ? Nobody picked that Michigan would destroy Westerm Michigan - at home.

Because you guys don't know. Your the mighty Wolverines with all these top knotch recruits and your incredible coach (who was your 4th choice) along with Barwis, etc - and nobody went out on the ledge to say we are going to beat Western ? That does not sound liek a team catching up. You fans won't admit it but your nervous. You don't know how this year will turn out or how Tate will play when it counts. You also have zero confidence in your defense. So don't try to pass your Kool-Aid on me that Michigan is catching up - because eben you guys are not sure thats the case. Your just praying that they are at this point.

How do we know? RR's track record suggests that this team will make big strides this year. How do you even know RR was the 4th choice? To my knowledge the only coach offered was possibly Miles. Just because other coaches were interviewed does not mean they were offered or were ranked ahead of RR.

Nervous? I'm not in the least bit nervous. This season can't but be better than last season. Your team on the other hand does have the possiblity of imploding.

[The Michigan Man]

How do we know? RR's track record suggests that this team will make big strides this year. How do you even know RR was the 4th choice? To my knowledge the only coach offered was possibly Miles. Just because other coaches were interviewed does not mean they were offered or were ranked ahead of RR.

Nervous? I'm not in the least bit nervous. This season can't but be better than last season. Your team on the other hand does have the possiblity of imploding.

If only the trolls were honest with themselves they wouldn't keep pretending that last year was a year that was indicative of RR's best. It was just like the 1st year at WV.

Tressels days are numbered - everyone in Ann Arbor thought the Cooper years were the end of tUOS. UM fans were wrong then just like tUOS fans are wrong today. 2010 will the 1st of a dozen or so years of RR domination. Then tUOS will bring in someone that will have his number, and so on, just like its always been.

[1OSUNUT]

Sure Michigan is going to come into Columbus when TP is a junior and we have almost all of out offense and defense back - and win. You on drugs. If Michigan does not win this year at home then they will not beat Ohio State for many years - and the odds are horribly thin that you will even be competitive. I don't think Tate will even be active come the last game of the season so you guys will already have a built in excuse. I think your undersized offensive line will get him killed long before the Buckeyes get their hands on him.

[Wolvrin704]

Sure Michigan is going to come into Columbus when TP is a junior and we have almost all of out offense and defense back - and win. You on drugs. If Michigan does not win this year at home then they will not beat Ohio State for many years - and the odds are horribly thin that you will even be competitive. I don't think Tate will even be active come the last game of the season so you guys will already have a built in excuse. I think your undersized offensive line will get him killed long before the Buckeyes get their hands on him.

You are so full of crap. :rolleyes:

[1OSUNUT]

We will see. I was not to far off last season. You guys said the same thing when I said Michigan would win 5 games last year - I gave you to much credit last year. I thought you would of sucked less last year. This year will not be much different other then the fact that you have Delaware and a few other weak teams to at least get a few more wins (maybe) on paper so you look better. Lets see what you guys are saying after week one.

[Wolvrin704]

We will see. I was not to far off last season. You guys said the same thing when I said Michigan would win 5 games last year - I gave you to much credit last year. I thought you would of sucked less last year. This year will not be much different other then the fact that you have Delaware and a few other weak teams to at least get a few more wins (maybe) on paper so you look better. Lets see what you guys are saying after week one.

Eventually you'll be wrong as the other teams in teh conference catch up and OSU begins to slip. Don't say it won't happen because it does in every conference. Eventually the top dogs go down even if its only for one season. We had ours last year. Seems you guys had one about 9 years ago as well and are about due for another.

[rickyleach]

if you think pryor and ohio state are going to beat michigan in michigan ,your dreamin, michigan has most of their team back from last year and tate is already better then those 2 stooges we had last season, michigan will beat ohio state on a regular basis ,,,,,,,starting this season, pryor is going to be 6.6 295 lbs and be a great tight end someday , qb he ainttt..

[RADRACING]

You've got allot more roadblocks this season than USC. The rest of the Big Ten is starting to catch up.

Where you hear that? The Big Ten is supposed to be down, worse than last year, it's turning into an embarrassing conference.

For everyones info a returning crappy team is still a crappy team, no reason to gloat we have a bunch of players returning, because that doesn't mean squat till the actually prove it on the field, at this point the team can't even field a punt if it's status quo from last year.

[byebyelloyd]

Sure Michigan is going to come into Columbus when TP is a junior and we have almost all of out offense and defense back - and win. You on drugs. If Michigan does not win this year at home then they will not beat Ohio State for many years - and the odds are horribly thin that you will even be competitive. I don't think Tate will even be active come the last game of the season so you guys will already have a built in excuse. I think your undersized offensive line will get him killed long before the Buckeyes get their hands on him.

yeah pussy, like ginn getting hurt, or wells being out of games, or inexperience, or any other pussy excuse we've heard over the years. heres a novel idea, BE A MAN, QUIT BEING A HOMER PUSSY and contribute something intelligent to a thread.

[1OSUNUT]

If Ohio State is out recruiting the whole conference and returning a large amount of their defense as well as TP - how are teams catching up ? The players we have coming in are better then the players that the other teams have coming in - so how are they catching up. How is Michigan catching up when we have a QB with a full season experience, a veteran defensive line and backfield and a fleet of top tier blue chip recruits (many #1 at their position) ready to play ?

Please explain how your catching up ?

[rickyleach]

im confused nutpiss, wasnt ohio state supposed to be great in 2006 even compared to fla, but guess what all of your 4 and 5 star talent got killed by a better team , afterall the team is more important then the individual, that is one more reason why your boy prymonkey will have a hard time, his idea of team IS ME ME ME ...

[1OSUNUT]

They were a great team that picked a bad night to play horrible. They for whatever reason either overlooked Florida, took the game for granted or just thought they were that good. They were still a very good team and one that crushed to dreams of you magots from up North. All the fans in The Shoe that day thought Michigan would win one for Bo - not so fast my friend. The better team won and sent you guys into a tail spin that you still have not recovered from. Seeing those fans crying was by far the highlight of the game. They were crushed when the Bucks broke your hearts. You guys have not been worth shit since then.

[byebyelloyd]

They were a great team that picked a bad night to play horrible. They for whatever reason either overlooked Florida, took the game for granted or just thought they were that good. They were still a very good team and one that crushed to dreams of you magots from up North. All the fans in The Shoe that day thought Michigan would win one for Bo - not so fast my friend. The better team won and sent you guys into a tail spin that you still have not recovered from. Seeing those fans crying was by far the highlight of the game. They were crushed when the Bucks broke your hearts. You guys have not been worth shit since then.

apparently this pussy hasn't seen the pictures of grown buckeye pussy men like himself with tears rolling down their face as they lost by 30 or 40 or whatever it was, guess it was hard for him to see that with his own tears and his head up his ass. besides, since we're talking history as you always do, that game was nothing in comparison to the 96 game when even more buckeye pussy men? were crying out loud, now that was great. anyway, considering michigan is the better team this year, ohio state will lose in ann arbor and will not win for quite a while after last year, how about some guesses as to your next head coach.

[rickyleach]

how about JOHN HOLMES JR AS THE NEXT COACH, THIS WAY NUT CAN WRAP HIS , LIPS AROUD A HUGE CHONIS YOU KNOW NUT, AS ALWAYS SERVICE WITH A SMILE..

[1OSUNUT]

I'm guessing that Tressel will be at OSU longe then RR will be at Michigan. He has a thing built into him called loyalty. RR is two faced. I cannot wait to see what you guys say when Ohio State walks into Ann Arbor and punks you chumps again. Then what ? Will RR finally have some pressure on him to do something ? If Michigan does not win this year - they might not win a game in this series for a very long time.

With the defense the Buckeyes will ride into Ann Arbor with this year I put your odds of winning the game at slim - and that is being nice.

[byebyelloyd]

I'm guessing that Tressel will be at OSU longe then RR will be at Michigan. He has a thing built into him called loyalty. RR is two faced. I cannot wait to see what you guys say when Ohio State walks into Ann Arbor and punks you chumps again. Then what ? Will RR finally have some pressure on him to do something ? If Michigan does not win this year - they might not win a game in this series for a very long time.

With the defense the Buckeyes will ride into Ann Arbor with this year I put your odds of winning the game at slim - and that is being nice.

considering how much more experience michgans offense has, 10 returning starters and now a Qb who can throw something you can't relate to, ohio state once again chases after another spread offense they can't stop and loses pretty badly. after that michigan returns more starters for the next several years and well tressel is losing and unemployed in 5-6 years, so any guesses?

[Wolvrin704]

I'm guessing that Tressel will be at OSU longe then RR will be at Michigan. He has a thing built into him called loyalty. RR is two faced. I cannot wait to see what you guys say when Ohio State walks into Ann Arbor and punks you chumps again. Then what ? Will RR finally have some pressure on him to do something ? If Michigan does not win this year - they might not win a game in this series for a very long time.

With the defense the Buckeyes will ride into Ann Arbor with this year I put your odds of winning the game at slim - and that is being nice.

You make this too easy. RR has had exactly 3 head coaching jobs. How does that make him unloyal? You're just trying to beat a dead horse over and over. Catch up with us to 2009 and quit living in 2008.

[1OSUNUT]

Michigan has returning starters off a lousy team that lost to Toledo. They have to improve a lot - just to be an OK team. Then you throw in a freshman QB - Ouch. Sure he looks great in practice - so did TP last year.

Things get a bit different when there is 100,000 plus watching. Tate will make a ton of mistakes. He will look good at times and horrible others. If you think he is going to just step in and be a instant sucess - man are you in for a long season.


The Buckeyes return many players in very key positions - namely on defense. The Buckeyes will be much better on defense then Michigan and should have no problem with those midgets you call linemen. Im not really worried about Michigan to tell you the absolute truth.

[rickyleach]

Well nut no one gives 2 fuccks what you think , michigan will run your slow overrated o line to death , fat and slow for the big block o

[amazinblue]

Michigan has returning starters off a lousy team that lost to Toledo. They have to improve a lot - just to be an OK team. Then you throw in a freshman QB - Ouch. Sure he looks great in practice - so did TP last year.

Things get a bit different when there is 100,000 plus watching. Tate will make a ton of mistakes. He will look good at times and horrible others. If you think he is going to just step in and be a instant sucess - man are you in for a long season.


The Buckeyes return many players in very key positions - namely on defense. The Buckeyes will be much better on defense then Michigan and should have no problem with those midgets you call linemen. Im not really worried about Michigan to tell you the absolute truth.

Nut,

Thanks - your writing is the equivalent of bulletin board material for the Michigan team. The one thing that I remind those that I coach - especially, in a home game - is that most everyone here wants you to succeed. They are here rooting for you to be successful. And, of the 100,000+ who will pack Michigan Stadium for home games this fall, over 90% of them will be rooting for Tate to succeed. Playing on the road will have it's challenges - and, we'll see just how well he'll do. I, for one, was pleased with how Chad Henne played as a true freshman. If Tate demonstrates similar maturity and ability, I'll be more than pleased.

Will he make mistakes? Yes, probably. No one (besides you, Tressel, and Pryor) is perfect.

I love the convoluted logic of you and your Buckeye brethren who can't see things realistically. Last year, OSU returned 22 senior starters - and, if you tell me the season was anything less than a disappointment, I'd be surprised.

Does OSU have the potential to be good this year? Sure, they do. Does Michigan have the potential to improve significantly this year? The answer is - yes, absolutely, yes. The Toledo game that you love to talk about turned around on 1 play, a 100 yard interception return.

I'm wondering - who are all those great returning starters you talk about? Ray Small? TP? Who else?

[1OSUNUT]

Take a look at the returners on the defensive side of the ball - very impressive. The crowd at the Big Hole is no big deal - the place is quiet. The Buckeyes will me ready for the game and the crowd will not bother them a bit. The Penn State game will get them ready for anything a Michigan crowd could throw at them. Maybe you can bring two sets of keys for that game.

[GoBlue21]

Take a look at the returners on the defensive side of the ball - very impressive.

What are you talking about....You lost Jenkins, Freeman, and Laurnaitis. Those were your Big 3 play-makers along with Washington, SUDDENLY you have an impressive returning defense...PUHLEASE!!!

Keep drinking YOUR Kool-Aid!!!

[amazinblue]

Take a look at the returners on the defensive side of the ball - very impressive. The crowd at the Big Hole is no big deal - the place is quiet. The Buckeyes will me ready for the game and the crowd will not bother them a bit. The Penn State game will get them ready for anything a Michigan crowd could throw at them. Maybe you can bring two sets of keys for that game.

Nut,

You're not worth replying to.

[1OSUNUT]

The Buckeye defense will be better then it was last year - mark it down. They have more depth at linebacker and the defensive line will be the best we have had in many years - maybe since 02. Homan, Rolle, Spitler, Hines, Sabino and Bell all will play and play well. Homan will remind many people of AJ Hawk when they see him play.

All I have to say is wait and see.

[rickyleach]

nut that is funny sshit you posted , what ever you do dont get in the car because youll blow way over the legal limit in ohio , here we go again ,WERE GONNA DO THIS AND WERE GONNA DO THAT , DONT WORRY 6 MONTHS AGO WE HAD SOME OF THE BEST PLAYERS EVER AT OHIO STATE ,AND NOW WE ARE A FAR BETTER TEAM WITHOUT THEM , DONT TELL ME THESE GREAT PLAYERS WHO SAT THE BENCH WERE PART OF OHIO STATES GAME PLAN , YA KNOW WHAT TRESSEL ,HAD TO HAVE BEEN COACHING THEM ,BECAUSE THATS AS DUMBASSS AS IT GETS , SUDDENLY YOU HAVE ALL THIS GREAT TALENT , NUT YOU ARE A FREEKIN IDIOT, ,YOU NEED TO QUIT SCREWIN TRESSEL OR HIS WIFE BECAUSE BOY YOUR AS DUUUUMMMM AS IT GETS. HA HA HA LLOOOOSSSEEERRR

[byebyelloyd]

The Buckeye defense will be better then it was last year - mark it down. They have more depth at linebacker and the defensive line will be the best we have had in many years - maybe since 02. Homan, Rolle, Spitler, Hines, Sabino and Bell all will play and play well. Homan will remind many people of AJ Hawk when they see him play.

All I have to say is wait and see.

all i have to say is wake the fuck up pussy, not only is ohio state having a bad down year, but they won't beat michigan again for at the least 6-7 years, now MARK THAT DOWN, FUCKING PUSSY.

[1OSUNUT]

Ricky and Byebye -

You guys are on crack - seriously. Look at what Ohio State has coming back on defense and also look at the depth at LB before you make stupid comments like that. Both of you guys are pathetic. Michigan is coming off their worst season ever - period. To just turn around and make a comment about beating the top dog in the Big Ten - without even seeing the team play is a joke (like you guys are). What have you seen that makes you think that Ohio State has not only slipped - but slipped to the point where Michigan has not only caught up, but surpassed the Buckeyes. I'm dying to know.

The last time Ricky shot his mouth off about Michigan winning because they were at home - they did not even muster 100 yards of total offense. In fact I love the fact that Ricky is picking Michigan to win this year, because he is never right. You two ass clowns think that a bunch of undersized linemen, a freshman QB and a pourous defense is going to do a lot better then last years team ? C'mon get real. RR must have spiked his jizz because you guys have bought in hook line and sinker. Michigan is still rebuilding. They will be better (because they could not get much worse) this year but not leaps and bounds.

Just because Michigan is at home does not mean that they are going to win. Michigan has a slight if any advantage in the Big Hole. If App.State and Toledo can walk in and win without a problem - I'm sure the Buckeyes will be just fine. Plus when your on the road you need a good defense - and the Buckeyes will have that. Ask some of the more educated Michigan fans on this site (there are not many) about some of the players coming back on defense for OSU. You people said the same thing when Hawk and the boys left two years ago - and we did not miss a beat on defense.

I cannot wait to hear the crap you guys come up with when reality kicks in after you lose the opener. When the Wolverines become the third or fourth best team in their own state - I will be there waiting for ya. I will have a whole new batch of ammo to unload on you guys. Then the excuses will start to fly and the boo birds will come out. Im expecting a half empty stadium before the clock even hits zero during the opener in AA. Maybe RR will cry again in his post game news conference - seems to be his MO. :D

[amazinblue]

You two ass clowns think that a bunch of undersized linemen

Nut,

I believe you need to understand the difference between size - and quick / agile. The "undersized" lineman you refer to don't appear to be all that small to me.


Bryant Nowicki* OL / 6-9 326 Sr./Jr.

Dann O'Neill OL / 6-7 312 So./Fr.

David Molk* OL / 6-2 283 Jr./So.

David Moosman* OL / 6-5 292 5th

Elliott Mealer OL / 6-6 299 So./Fr.

John Ferrara** OL / 6-4 280 Sr./Jr.

Kurt Wermers OL / 6-5 289 So./Fr.

Mark Huyge* OL / 6-6 291 Jr./So.

Mark Ortmann** OL / 6-7 284 5th

Patrick Omameh OL / 6-4 276 So./Fr.

Perry Dorrestein* OL / 6-7 310 Sr./Jr.

Ricky Barnum OL / 6-2 280 So./Fr.

Rocko Khoury OL / 6-5 291 So./Fr.

Stephen Schilling** OL / 6-5 304 Sr./Jr.

Tim McAvoy** OL / 6-6 297 5th 06/15/87

Tom Pomarico OL / 6-4 253 Jr./So.

Zac Ciullo OL / 6-1 273 Jr./So.


The big difference between this year and last is the condition that the O line and entire team will be in this season. The uptempo offense you'll see means a few things - first, a no huddle offense - which, will limit the substitutions a D can make... second, the relative physical conditioning of the Michigan squad compared to the competitors - which means that Michigan may have an advantage over teams that haven't had the same S&C program or emphasized the conditioning aspect; third, zone blocking and understanding of the schemes / playbook will make execution easier and reduce the ease with which opposing D's got to the QB last season. I would go on, but it would probably just be over your head. I'm sure that Boren's going to do great this year - and, I hope he adds another fifteen or twenty pounds between now and November.

[Wolvrin704]

This years UM team will in no way resemble last years.

With that said I will concede that NUT is probably right about the OSU D, they are still supposed to be good despite losing so many guys. But the question is will they be great? That remains to be seen.

[amazinblue]

With that said I will concede that NUT is probably right about the OSU D, they are still supposed to be good despite losing so many guys. But the question is will they be great? That remains to be seen.

704,

I agree with you - Tressel and the Buckeyes put a good team on the field. And, I would never take them lightly - especially in November. So, in my mind, the O and D will be "decent" to "good" - but, getting to "great", well, that's a leap for me. Frankly, I believe most were expecting OSU would be a "great" team going into last year. But, last year is history.

The biggest problem I have with several of the blind Buckeye followers is that they are not objective enough to identify specific areas where the team can improve. In their minds, OSU is impervious to attack and has no weaknesses. Every team has a weakness - some may be harder to find or attack - but, every team has a weakness.

Since most Buckeyes believe that TP is the "next coming" - I only wish that they would say "his legs are proven, he's working on his throwing - and, if his accuracy has improved during the off-season, and he's able to hit a relatively new receiving corps accurately - he'll be a dual threat and tough to defend." But, I never (or very rarely) hear anything that states any concern about the Buckeyes.

Though I want the Big 10 to win every OOC game. And, though I hate USC almost as much as OSU. I don't think I'll be too disappointed with the results of the game in the Shoe in September.

[The Michigan Man]

Michigan is coming off their worst season ever - period.

Simply not true. Michigan has had worse winning % in the past, only an uneducated fan would claim it was the worst ever.

I love the fact that the trolls think last year was indicative of the RR regime at Michigan, and that the team will never get better. It takes an amazing level of denial and a complete failure in understanding what RR was doing last year in choosing to develop his inexperienced players in running the spread rather than sort of half-assing it with a spread / pro style hybrid to win a few extra games.

This year the returning players all have a year of experience with it, and will help the freshman learn. That wasn't the case last year, where a complete rebuild was necessary.

This year will be much better, next year will be great, and the next 10 will be unbelievable as RR's scoring machine will be in full effect. The Tressel era is winding down, enjoy the last gasps as the momentum returns to Michigan. Hope you enjoyed it while it lasted.

[amazinblue]

MM,

I second your post...

[1OSUNUT]

Ohio State is in the same boat. Returning players that will help higher rated freshman learn. i don't see you catching us anytime soon. :D

[Wolvrin704]

Ohio State is in the same boat. Returning players that will help higher rated freshman learn. i don't see you catching us anytime soon. :D

The offensive scheme is what will eventually get us past your guys.

[1OSUNUT]

Maybe / Maybe not.

It did not do much to the teams in the Big East and RR had better talent then the teams he was playing. With RR being in the same conference there will be tons of film on Michigan. Just like the SEC teams know each other inside and out and the games are close - so will the Big Ten. Many teams are slowy putting in spread type plays and offenses. I did not see WV blowing teams out in the Big East - not even the bad ones.

Sure the spread offense is hard to stop when your not used to it. When RR had weeks to come up with a game plan he did surprise teams that may have taken WV lightly. Nobody takes Michigan lightly and they always have a target on them. Do you think Tressel is not going to do everything in his power to have the Buckeyes ready for RR and Michigan ? To RR (he said so himself) Michigan has many BIG games. To Ohio State we have one big game.

You guys can say whatever you want about Tressel - but you cannot deny the fact that his teams are always ready for Michigan. Nothing will change. Spread or no spread - teams will adapt. Ohio State and Michigan will always have the best players and the games will be close - no matter what kind of offense either one runs. The Buckeyes have just as much (or in the case of the last few years more) talent as Michigan does. Many of these kids are taught at a young age to HATE Michigan. Gone are the Cooper days where it was just another game (like it is for RR) - it is the game.

Teams (not just OSU) will adapt to Michigan and it will be no big deal. Look how fast teams adapted to Illinois - same thing. The Big Ten is a rough and physical defensive conference - and that will not change.

[amazinblue]

Hmmm.. not sure where to begin on this. There are so many folks out here talking about this scheme - that scheme - The Pistol offense for TP, various versions of the spread, etc. The belief is that everyone will see the offense and be familiar with it - and able to defend it.

I've got some news for you. It's not "the scheme" that's important - it's the EXECUTION of a scheme or philosophy that's important - that determines whether a team will be successful and effective or not.

Look back a bit in time to the Green Bay Packers under Lombardi - they ran a sweep - everyone knew they were going to run the sweep - and despite the fact the teams knew what they were going to do, it was rarely stopped. Why? Because of superior execution.

For those who love Michigan / OSU games from years past - look at the option during the ten year war. Everyone knew what was going to happen. It was assignment football at its finest (or certainly very, very good assignment football). What made those games especially great was execution - in many of those games - by both teams.

So, the Big 10 can have 11 teams running the spread - and, it won't matter. Why? Because I'm confident that the execution of the Michigan team, it's depth, speed, and talent will make a difference. I'm not stupid enough to think team's won't slow it down - or that it won't struggle - BUT, I do have faith in the staff, and the players - that the Michigan version will be tough to stop. Why, you ask. Well, the philosophy beginning with S&C - the speed that's being recruited and developed - and then execution on Saturdays. What will make Michigan "more dangerous" than the average team is the breadth of players and positions. If you look at how RR is recruiting - he's getting speed and skill (and will develop the strength) at ALL positions in the offense. So, a team will not be able to key on one or two individual players or positions - defenses will be forced to key in on a few players - and (assuming the QB is reading well and coordinators are calling solid plays) - the mismatches can exploit any defensive lapse for a solid gain.

What we are beginning to see is the breadth of recruiting at the critical positions - and this is also resulting in depth at key positions as well. Opposing D's will be forced into more isolation coverage - and the mismatches will be capitalized on. The other challenge D's will face is, IMO, relearning fundamentals. Far too many D-1 players rely on physical ability, rather than sound fundamentals, to make plays. For those D's facing Michigan in the future, who don't have sound fundamentals - the Saturday afternoons will be very long.

Execution has been the difference, and execution will remain the difference. As many say in business, an "ok" strategy executed well is better than a "perfect" strategy executed poorly. What you'll see coming out of Ann Arbor is a very good strategy, executed extremely well - which will be very tough to stop.

Well, that's my take on it...

[gator]

It takes an amazing level of denial and a complete failure in understanding what RR was doing last year in choosing to develop his inexperienced players in running the spread rather than sort of half-assing it with a spread / pro style hybrid to win a few extra games.


To me this is going to be the most interesting aspect of UM football this season. Did UM make the right call in going completely spread on these guys and not really adapting to the talent that was there? I think RR is a really good coach. In fact, I see a lot of similarities between him and Urban. What is different, is that Urban always says, and indeed it appears, that he adapts his scheme to his available talent. Honestly, could there have been a less adept QB for Urban's spread than Chris Leak? Urban's system takes huge advantage of QB runs when the blocking scheme is in our favor, but Chris Leak couldn't run through a fingernail tackle. Further, every time we tried to run an option, I don't know why the other team even guarded him....you knew he wasn't going to keep it. Still he found ways to make Leak effective. Personally, I think RR made the right call since the team was so young and Mallett ended up leaving. You will certainly have a guy more adept at running RR's scheme this year. Nevertheless, it may have paid quicker dividends to have used Mallett more to his ability (allowing him to stay) and not have a freshman taking snaps this year. I guess we'll never truly know, but I'm anxious to see how Tate does in this system as a freshman.

[The Michigan Man]

Maybe / Maybe not.

It did not do much to the teams in the Big East and RR had better talent then the teams he was playing. With RR being in the same conference there will be tons of film on Michigan. Just like the SEC teams know each other inside and out and the games are close - so will the Big Ten. Many teams are slowy putting in spread type plays and offenses. I did not see WV blowing teams out in the Big East - not even the bad ones.

Sure the spread offense is hard to stop when your not used to it. When RR had weeks to come up with a game plan he did surprise teams that may have taken WV lightly. Nobody takes Michigan lightly and they always have a target on them. Do you think Tressel is not going to do everything in his power to have the Buckeyes ready for RR and Michigan ? To RR (he said so himself) Michigan has many BIG games. To Ohio State we have one big game.

You guys can say whatever you want about Tressel - but you cannot deny the fact that his teams are always ready for Michigan. Nothing will change. Spread or no spread - teams will adapt. Ohio State and Michigan will always have the best players and the games will be close - no matter what kind of offense either one runs. The Buckeyes have just as much (or in the case of the last few years more) talent as Michigan does. Many of these kids are taught at a young age to HATE Michigan. Gone are the Cooper days where it was just another game (like it is for RR) - it is the game.

Teams (not just OSU) will adapt to Michigan and it will be no big deal. Look how fast teams adapted to Illinois - same thing. The Big Ten is a rough and physical defensive conference - and that will not change.

1) RR won the Big East 4 of the 7 years he was there and was Big East coach of the Year 3 times. He also clobbered OK, GT, and Georgia. WV wasn't some obscure school without game film available, opposing coaches had the same shot at decyphering the spread, and couldn't do it.

3) USC plays in the same conference every year, with plenty of game film - why hasn't anyone been able to dethrone them (aside from an occasional upset) from being PAC 10 champs?

3) Anyone who was taking a team lightly in a BCS bowl doesn't deserve to be a HC and should be fired. No one was taking WV lightly.

4) Tressel was always prepared for Michigan because he always played Carr. Given the horribly prepared teams that he fielded against more creative offenses like Myer, Miles, and Carroll run, tUOS got torched. Under RR Michigan will resemble an SEC team / USC, not a Bo team anymore.

5) The dislike for your rival transcends coaches. It was there long before Cooper / Tressel and will be there long after Tressel is gone. Tressel has been winning because Michigan had a fossil for a coach, not because Tressel's players "hated" Michigan more than Michigan's players hated tUOS.




To me this is going to be the most interesting aspect of UM football this season. Did UM make the right call in going completely spread on these guys and not really adapting to the talent that was there? I think RR is a really good coach. In fact, I see a lot of similarities between him and Urban. What is different, is that Urban always says, and indeed it appears, that he adapts his scheme to his available talent. Honestly, could there have been a less adept QB for Urban's spread than Chris Leak? Urban's system takes huge advantage of QB runs when the blocking scheme is in our favor, but Chris Leak couldn't run through a fingernail tackle. Further, every time we tried to run an option, I don't know why the other team even guarded him....you knew he wasn't going to keep it. Still he found ways to make Leak effective. Personally, I think RR made the right call since the team was so young and Mallett ended up leaving. You will certainly have a guy more adept at running RR's scheme this year. Nevertheless, it may have paid quicker dividends to have used Mallett more to his ability (allowing him to stay) and not have a freshman taking snaps this year. I guess we'll never truly know, but I'm anxious to see how Tate does in this system as a freshman.

I think that once the proper personnel are on the field, it is possible to be more adaptive, ala Myer with Leak. With absolutely no one experienced with the spread, RR had to make a tough choice - either drag the growing pains out over a few seasons or bite the bullet and fully immerse the team into it, knowing that games would be sacrificed.

[rickyleach]

nothing has changed for ohio state ,they still have the big fat slow guys up front ,they didnt recruit guys to run the spread ,and best of all ,THEY STILL HAVE NUMNUTS TRESSEL RUNNING THE SHOW, AFTER A FEW MORE BIG LOSSES TO RANKED TEAMS ,THE OSU FAITHFUL WILL WANT TO TAKE THAT SWEATERVEST AND WRAP IT AROUND OH JIMMIES NECK, WERE GONNA DO THIS AND WERE GONNA DO THAT , PA LEEZE , navy is going to give osu all they can handle , and ofcourse usc will do a woodshed job on them , in the horechew

[byebyelloyd]

Maybe / Maybe not.

It did not do much to the teams in the Big East and RR had better talent then the teams he was playing. With RR being in the same conference there will be tons of film on Michigan. Just like the SEC teams know each other inside and out and the games are close - so will the Big Ten. Many teams are slowy putting in spread type plays and offenses. I did not see WV blowing teams out in the Big East - not even the bad ones.

Sure the spread offense is hard to stop when your not used to it. When RR had weeks to come up with a game plan he did surprise teams that may have taken WV lightly. Nobody takes Michigan lightly and they always have a target on them. Do you think Tressel is not going to do everything in his power to have the Buckeyes ready for RR and Michigan ? To RR (he said so himself) Michigan has many BIG games. To Ohio State we have one big game.

You guys can say whatever you want about Tressel - but you cannot deny the fact that his teams are always ready for Michigan. Nothing will change. Spread or no spread - teams will adapt. Ohio State and Michigan will always have the best players and the games will be close - no matter what kind of offense either one runs. The Buckeyes have just as much (or in the case of the last few years more) talent as Michigan does. Many of these kids are taught at a young age to HATE Michigan. Gone are the Cooper days where it was just another game (like it is for RR) - it is the game.

Teams (not just OSU) will adapt to Michigan and it will be no big deal. Look how fast teams adapted to Illinois - same thing. The Big Ten is a rough and physical defensive conference - and that will not change.

wishful thinking pussy. ohio state has no chance of adapting on defense with tressel there. you may hate michigan and everything about it, but you get to watch them destroy ohio state starting this year with the offense that tressel can only shake his head about because he has no clue what its all about.

[byebyelloyd]

To me this is going to be the most interesting aspect of UM football this season. Did UM make the right call in going completely spread on these guys and not really adapting to the talent that was there? I think RR is a really good coach. In fact, I see a lot of similarities between him and Urban. What is different, is that Urban always says, and indeed it appears, that he adapts his scheme to his available talent. Honestly, could there have been a less adept QB for Urban's spread than Chris Leak? Urban's system takes huge advantage of QB runs when the blocking scheme is in our favor, but Chris Leak couldn't run through a fingernail tackle. Further, every time we tried to run an option, I don't know why the other team even guarded him....you knew he wasn't going to keep it. Still he found ways to make Leak effective. Personally, I think RR made the right call since the team was so young and Mallett ended up leaving. You will certainly have a guy more adept at running RR's scheme this year. Nevertheless, it may have paid quicker dividends to have used Mallett more to his ability (allowing him to stay) and not have a freshman taking snaps this year. I guess we'll never truly know, but I'm anxious to see how Tate does in this system as a freshman.

yeah, ok, what do you think would have happened if rodriguez took over a spread team like meyer inherited from zook, who stills runs a spread in illinois? thank god rich changed the offense at michigan from the 10 plays on one sheet of paper made in the 1800's like lloyd used. you have 1nutsackpussy acting like ohio state can adapt to it although they've been fucking DESTROYED by it EVERY year and never will figure out whats going on until tressel gets fired, about 5-6 years. hey 1nutsack, its funny how the big ten is on top of he world when michigan takes the lead and is the fucking laughing stock of the nation when ohio state leads. oh well, michigan is taking its historical spot atop the big ten again and we no longer have to listen to pussies like on this site for another 2-3 decades.

[rickyleach]

BYEBYELOYD, what a great post , couldnt have said it better myself ..

[1OSUNUT]

When you win more then 3 games in a season then talk to me about being back. Being a .500 ball club like your going to be this year is not exactly being on top.

[Wolvrin704]

When you win more then 3 games in a season then talk to me about being back. Being a .500 ball club like your going to be this year is not exactly being on top.

Winningest program in college football history gives us enough slack to have one down year in 40+.

[rickyleach]

nut take your wifes candle out of your asss and then talk to me about football , ohio state is like a stale potato chip , your program is old and predictable ,out dated and over the hill , close to being DEAD , your school is 85 wins away from overtaking michigan for all time , tressel is on his way out ,his pussy is hurting , 8 and 4 or 9 and 3 is about right for your team plus getting their asssssess handed to them in their bowl ,

[1OSUNUT]

Brewster was quoted in todays Plain Dealer that TP is working hard on his throwing mechanics and is getting much better. He also said TP ran a 4.3 40 and his weight was 235 - nice.

[byebyelloyd]

Brewster was quoted in todays Plain Dealer that TP is working hard on his throwing mechanics and is getting much better. He also said TP ran a 4.3 40 and his weight was 235 - nice.

working hard is hardly being able to pass, you should learn to nicely differentiate between to truth and your own lies pussy.

[amazinblue]

Brewster was quoted in todays Plain Dealer that TP is working hard on his throwing mechanics and is getting much better. He also said TP ran a 4.3 40 and his weight was 235 - nice.

Nut,

Come on now - what do you think they are going to say? TP is taking the summer off. Of course he's working on his throwing mechanics - because - they are poor. And, getting much better - I've got something for you. Let's say Michigan improves its record by 100% this year - then, we'd be .500 - six wins. If TP improves his throwing mechanics by 100% - he'll still have a long way to go...

[The Michigan Man]

Brewster was quoted in todays Plain Dealer that TP is working hard on his throwing mechanics and is getting much better. He also said TP ran a 4.3 40 and his weight was 235 - nice.

Isn't it a little bit disturbing that the most highly sought after player in the history of mankind is having to work on something as elementary as basic throwing mechanics, a skill that most average to above average QBs at that level have mastered? There are 15 year olds playing catch in my neighborhood with better mechanics than TP.

[1OSUNUT]

Yet he still had one of the if not the highest comp % in the Big Ten last year. TP did make some nice throws last year - so he has the ability. You guys make it sound like he cannot throw at all. If that was the case RR would not have wanted him as much as he did. He will be just fine and that is bad news for Michigan and the rest of the Big Ten.

[The Michigan Man]

Yet he still had one of the if not the highest comp % in the Big Ten last year. TP did make some nice throws last year - so he has the ability. You guys make it sound like he cannot throw at all. If that was the case RR would not have wanted him as much as he did. He will be just fine and that is bad news for Michigan and the rest of the Big Ten.

I think that most objective, non-tUOS observers would agree that the perception of TP the HS recruit is much different than the perception of TP the tUOS QB.

RR recruited the TP who appeared to be able to throw (against HS caliber competition), not the guy who was playing for tUOS last year. I don't want him either, I'd much rather have a Forcier who can thread a needle and is still very mobile, rather than a guy that can't throw down field with accuracy and is basically limited to making something happen with his feet on every play.

As far as completion %, TP was 5/13 against a very limited Michigan secondary last year - tUOS won big because of Beanie, and TPs effort doesn't exactly frighten anyone in Ann Arbor.

[Don Unverferth]

I think that most objective, non-tUOS observers would agree that the perception of TP the HS recruit is much different than the perception of TP the tUOS QB.

RR recruited the TP who appeared to be able to throw (against HS caliber competition), not the guy who was playing for tUOS last year. I don't want him either, I'd much rather have a Forcier who can thread a needle and is still very mobile, rather than a guy that can't throw down field with accuracy and is basically limited to making something happen with his feet on every play.

As far as completion %, TP was 5/13 against a very limited Michigan secondary last year - tUOS won big because of Beanie, and TPs effort doesn't exactly frighten anyone in Ann Arbor.

Hey Ugly. When Tater Tot survives a full season and threads the needle against legitimate D1 talent and wins "freshman of the year" award, then start sucking his dick. Until then any comparisons to TP is well, ridiculous.

[The Michigan Man]

Hey Ugly. When Tater Tot survives a full season and threads the needle against legitimate D1 talent and wins "freshman of the year" award, then start sucking his dick. Until then any comparisons to TP is well, ridiculous.

Mahzeltoff,

You're right, comparing Forcier to TP is ridiculous - the former is actually a well-rounded QB with proper throwing mechanics, not a glorified WR that throws like a 12 year old girl.

[Don Unverferth]

Mahzeltoff,

You're right, comparing Forcier to TP is ridiculous - the former is actually a well-rounded QB with proper throwing mechanics, not a glorified WR that throws like a 12 year old girl.

That's just foolish. Tater Tot is well rounded? You mean against H.S. talent and UM sub-par MAC equivalent talent?

TP didn't have the luxury of working with the offense in the spring yet still impressed and won "freshman of the year" award.

Oh, and you're getting uglier.

[Wolvrin704]

That's just foolish. Tater Tot is well rounded? You mean against H.S. talent and UM sub-par MAC equivalent talent?

TP didn't have the luxury of working with the offense in the spring yet still impressed and won "freshman of the year" award.

Oh, and you're getting uglier.

This is just priceless. A year ago you guys raved about how talented TP was based on how he played in HS and how he looked in camp. Yet guys are doing the same about Tate this year and suddenly its foolish? Where's the consistency?

As for "freshman of the year", where exactly did this award come from and who voted on it? Its not an NCAA sanctioned award.

[Don Unverferth]

This is just priceless. A year ago you guys raved about how talented TP was based on how he played in HS and how he looked in camp. Yet guys are doing the same about Tate this year and suddenly its foolish? Where's the consistency?

The hype was justified. Be honest, Forcier is not nearly as talented as TP, yet you guys are stroking him like he is. Where exactly did TP let us down as a true freshman last year? Not winning the Heisman maybe? I recall that he also led us to a Big Ten Championship, a BCS bowl and a top ten ranking.



As for "freshman of the year", where exactly did this award come from and who voted on it? Its not an NCAA sanctioned award.

?? Every year the Big ten coaches and media select a "freshman of the year".

[1OSUNUT]

Let us see what Tate does this year. Let's compare the record and stats at the end of the year and see how he matches up with TP. My guess is Tate will not even last a full season behind that line. We will see.


I'm also guessing Tate will not be "Freshman of the Year" or lead his team to the Big Ten Championship.

[Don Unverferth]

Let us see what Tate does this year. Let's compare the record and stats at the end of the year and see how he matches up with TP. My guess is Tate will not even last a full season behind that line. We will see.


I'm also guessing Tate will not be "Freshman of the Year" or lead his team to the Big Ten Championship.

Excellent guess.

And for those trying to imply that Forcier is as good or a better talent than TP, Forcier's published offer list was only a bit better than Threet's, and their rankings by the commercial services were virtually identical (both 4*'s, with near-identical position rankings). Further, I think it would be accurate to say that many of the UM fans who now view Threet as having been a 2nd-tier prospect were not nearly as pessimistic about his suitability a year ago.

[The Michigan Man]

Let us see what Tate does this year. Let's compare the record and stats at the end of the year and see how he matches up with TP. My guess is Tate will not even last a full season behind that line. We will see.

I'm also guessing Tate will not be "Freshman of the Year" or lead his team to the Big Ten Championship.

The "Freshman of the Year" was sort of a plug in behind a very experienced O-line, WRs, and pre-season Heisman Trophy candidate favorite Beanie. It would have took a colossal screw up to not thrive while surrounded by this talent, wouldn't it?

As far as the Michigan O-line, this year's is going to be much improved. A year of experience with the offense and a year in the gym with Barwis will make a huge difference.


Excellent guess.

And for those trying to imply that Forcier is as good or a better talent than TP, Forcier's published offer list was only a bit better than Threet's, and their rankings by the commercial services were virtually identical (both 4*'s, with near-identical position rankings). Further, I think it would be accurate to say that many of the UM fans who now view Threet as having been a 2nd-tier prospect and clearly a poor fit for Rodriguez's offense, were not nearly as pessimistic about his suitability a year ago.

Mahzeltoff

Yeah, genius, all highly rated QBs are identical. Saying a spread QB and a pro style QB are exactly the same and have the same probability of success / failure because they have the same star rating is ignorant. I'll simplify it for you: Forcier has speed, Threet didn't.

[rickyleach]

wait a second nut ,thats not fair , REMEMBER YOUR GREAT COACH TRESSY SAID PRYOR HAS AN ADVANTAGE BY LEARNING FROM SENIOR LEADERSHIP , STRAIGHT FROM THE HORSES ASSS , SO YOU CANT BE FAIR AND RATE TATE ..

[Wolvrin704]

The hype was justified. Be honest, Forcier is not nearly as talented as TP, yet you guys are stroking him like he is. Where exactly did TP let us down as a true freshman last year? Not winning the Heisman maybe? I recall that he also led us to a Big Ten Championship, a BCS bowl and a top ten ranking.




?? Every year the Big ten coaches and media select a "freshman of the year".

No the hype was not quite justified. He is good but not as great as we were led to believe. As for Tate, I believe he will be a good QB but don't lump us all as stroking him as being great this year, because I have my doubts he will be. He may be good enough not to kill the O most of the time but I doubt he will be great this year.

You have made winning "freshman of the year" sound like a national award. Since its only B10 its almost pointless, big fish in a little pond.

[Wolvrin704]

Let us see what Tate does this year. Let's compare the record and stats at the end of the year and see how he matches up with TP. My guess is Tate will not even last a full season behind that line. We will see.


I'm also guessing Tate will not be "Freshman of the Year" or lead his team to the Big Ten Championship.

This is not a justifiable comparison by any means.

TP had a senior QB to learn from, didn't start unitl what the 4th game, an upper classmen heavy and experienced O-line, a Heisman contending RB, experienced upper classman WR's, a deep and VERY expereinced D and a football staff who had been in place for many years. Not to mention that this team was supposed to be contending for the NC.

Tate's 1st year will be vastly different. Possibly starting from day 1, an O-line that has some experience but mostly under classmen, WR's that are mostly under classmen, an expereinced RB who has never cracked 1000 yds and has absolutely no Heisman talk, a D with allot of question marks and a coaching staff that has only been in place for 1 year. Plus the team isn't even expected to have a winning record.

Apples and oranges.

[amazinblue]

704,

What was the returning number of seniors / upperclassmen for OSU's 2008 National Title Team? I think it was 22 returning / senior starters from the 2007 season - the team poised to win the NC. We saw how that turned out - oh, Don - I forgot to congratulate you on a great year...

[Don Unverferth]

This is not a justifiable comparison by any means.

TP had a senior QB to learn from, didn't start unitl what the 4th game, an upper classmen heavy and experienced O-line, a Heisman contending RB, experienced upper classman WR's, a deep and VERY expereinced D and a football staff who had been in place for many years. Not to mention that this team was supposed to be contending for the NC.

I'm not the one making Tate out to be as good or better than TP. Unless you were watching the PBA and not OSU games, you would know that our O line was underachieving at best last year. We needed Pryor and his wheels to avoid the sack when the pocket collapsed. That's correct that Pryor didn't start initially because we had an experienced senior. All the more accolades to a true freshman for winning the starting job and proving that he was the best freshman in the conference without having competed in spring practice or starting early in the season.


Tate's 1st year will be vastly different. Possibly starting from day 1, an O-line that has some experience but mostly under classmen, WR's that are mostly under classmen, an expereinced RB who has never cracked 1000 yds and has absolutely no Heisman talk, a D with allot of question marks and a coaching staff that has only been in place for 1 year. Plus the team isn't even expected to have a winning record.


The excuses are already in place for Tate I see.

[Don Unverferth]

The "Freshman of the Year" was sort of a plug in behind a very experienced O-line, WRs, and pre-season Heisman Trophy candidate favorite Beanie. It would have took a colossal screw up to not thrive while surrounded by this talent, wouldn't it?

Hey Ugly. You need to stop painting your toe nails while watching OSU games. Any dummy who actually watched the games knew that our O-line did not protect the QB.


As far as the Michigan O-line, this year's is going to be much improved. A year of experience with the offense and a year in the gym with Barwis will make a huge difference.

Yea, Barwis made quite an impact on last years team, obviously his conditioning was inadequate. If he keeps up the good work it will be 2 and out for RRod and crew for sure.




Yeah, genius, all highly rated QBs are identical. Saying a spread QB and a pro style QB are exactly the same and have the same probability of success / failure because they have the same star rating is ignorant. I'll simplify it for you: Forcier has speed, Threet didn't.

Never mentioned that they were identical. Obviously the talent level was very similar though coming out of HS. That was my point. Try reading my posts ugly.

[Wolvrin704]

I'm not the one making Tate out to be as good or better than TP. Unless you were watching the PBA and not OSU games, you would know that our O line was underachieving at best last year. We needed Pryor and his wheels to avoid the sack when the pocket collapsed. That's correct that Pryor didn't start initially because we had an experienced senior. All the more accolades to a true freshman for winning the starting job and proving that he was the best freshman in the conference without having competed in spring practice or starting early in the season.




The excuses are already in place for Tate I see.

TP didn't win the job as much as the coaching staff lost confidence in Boeckman.

I'm not making excuses for Tate. All I'm doing is showing that the comparisons for team records is unfair as the circumsatnces are far different. Quit being an idiot Don.

[Don Unverferth]

TP didn't win the job as much as the coaching staff lost confidence in Boeckman.


I'm not making excuses for Tate. All I'm doing is showing that the comparisons for team records is unfair as the circumsatnces are far different. Quit being an idiot Don.

C'mon, who's the idiot? Now you can interpret our coaching decisions? The coaches didn't lose trust or confidence in Boeckman, he was the experienced leader of the offense and the team captain. Pryor simply had better athleticism.

How can comparing the team records be unfair? You played basically the same schedule as we did. We can't be penalized for having better players and coaches.

[Wolvrin704]

C'mon, who's the idiot? Now you can interpret our coaching decisions? The coaches didn't lose trust or confidence in Boeckman, he was the experienced leader of the offense and the team captain. Pryor simply had better athleticism.

How can comparing the team records be unfair? You played basically the same schedule as we did. We can't be penalized for having better players and coaches.

Penalized? Are we keeping score? You're being ridiculous.

Again, you had a NC contending team with 3 Heisman contending players(Wells, Boeckman and Laurinitas) and many other award contending players with 22 returning starters and a huge amount of seniors. Our team is loaded with under classmen, is not a NC contendor, no one with any Heisman talk. TP was under no pressure because of Boeckman, suceed or fail he was still there. Tate has absolutely none of that going for him so how is that a fair comparison?

If the coaches didn't lose confidence in Boeckman then why replace him? He had been All-Big Ten the year before, had Heisman talk at the start of the year about him and suddenly was replaced after a bad outing at USC? He was made the fall guy for Wells injuries and poor O-line play. Even when TP struggled they rarely brought Boeckman in the remainder of the season.

[Don Unverferth]

Penalized? Are we keeping score? You're being ridiculous.

Again, you had a NC contending team with 3 Heisman contending players(Wells, Boeckman and Laurinitas) and many other award contending players with 22 returning starters and a huge amount of seniors. Our team is loaded with under classmen, is not a NC contendor, no one with any Heisman talk. TP was under no pressure because of Boeckman, suceed or fail he was still there. Tate has absolutely none of that going for him so how is that a fair comparison?

If the coaches didn't lose confidence in Boeckman then why replace him? He had been All-Big Ten the year before, had Heisman talk at the start of the year about him and suddenly was replaced after a bad outing at USC? He was made the fall guy for Wells injuries and poor O-line play. Even when TP struggled they rarely brought Boeckman in the remainder of the season.

You're getting stupid like Michigan Man. Pryor was under constant pressure because our O-line sucked. Get it? Boeckman did not have the wheels to avoid the pressure. The decision was made to not rotate the two QB's and to let TP gain confidence. It worked. Boeckman was there helping our coaching staff, true. Boo hoo, Tater Tot doesn't have a senior QB to help nurture him. He has coaches right? Or maybe not. :D
Cone and Sheridan are older and can hold his hand if necessary I'm sure.

Again, thank you for pointing out how superior we are in personnel.

[Wolvrin704]

You're getting stupid like Michigan Man. Pryor was under constant pressure because our O-line sucked. Get it? Boeckman did not have the wheels to avoid the pressure. The decision was made to not rotate the two QB's and to let TP gain confidence. It worked. Boeckman was there helping our coaching staff, true. Boo hoo, Tater Tot doesn't have a senior QB to help nurture him. He has coaches right? Or maybe not. :D
Cone and Sheridan are older and can hold his hand if necessary I'm sure.

Again, thank you for pointing out how superior we are in personnel.

And again you're agreeing with what we said happened under Carr which led to our 3-9 season last year. WE HAD NO EXPERIENCED PLAYERS LEFT!

What you guys don't get was last year at this time you were bragging on how your team would win the NC and how they were just loaded. Yet your great O-line (which was supposed to be a strength) couldn't keep anyone off Boeckman. Didn't you have any O-line coaches? :eek:

[amazinblue]

Pryor was under constant pressure because our O-line sucked.

Again, thank you for pointing out how superior we are in personnel.

Don,

I'm trying to figure something out and was wondering if you could help me. How does a senior laden team that returned 22 starters with a lot of NC predictions turn into one that had to rely on a freshman QB and and O'line that sucked? Could it be that the S&C and position coaches didn't develop their talent?

Personally, I'm looking forward to seeing how well Boren performs after a season with the OSU staff. I believe it just may indicate how superior you are in personnel.

[Don Unverferth]

Don,

I'm trying to figure something out and was wondering if you could help me. How does a senior laden team that returned 22 starters with a lot of NC predictions turn into one that had to rely on a freshman QB and and O'line that sucked? Could it be that the S&C and position coaches didn't develop their talent?

Personally, I'm looking forward to seeing how well Boren performs after a season with the OSU staff. I believe it just may indicate how superior you are in personnel.

Honestly there has been a great amount of concern over the position coaching of the O-line. No other area on the team underperforms like the O-Line.

Here’s the problem I see it, though it’s not so much during the week at practice, but when the game begins. Bollman is not only the offensive coordinator, but he’s also the line coach as well. During the game, Bollman is up in the press box connected to Tressel via the headset. A little hard to get these guys fired up when you are sitting at the top of the stadium.

What needs to happen is not so much that Bollman has to be fired, but at the very least someone needs to be hired to specifically coach the offensive line and be down on the field during the game.

I mean there’s already a quarterbacks coach, a running backs coach, a wide receivers coach, and a tight ends coach. So why doesn’t the offensive line has its’ own coach?

Personally, I would love to see Jim Lachey or another former player take over the O-line, someone who could light a fire under these guys.

[BBA1994]

Honestly there has been a great amount of concern over the position coaching of the O-line. No other area on the team underperforms like the O-Line.

Here’s the problem I see it, though it’s not so much during the week at practice, but when the game begins. Bollman is not only the offensive coordinator, but he’s also the line coach as well. During the game, Bollman is up in the press box connected to Tressel via the headset. A little hard to get these guys fired up when you are sitting at the top of the stadium.

What needs to happen is not so much that Bollman has to be fired, but at the very least someone needs to be hired to specifically coach the offensive line and be down on the field during the game.

I mean there’s already a quarterbacks coach, a running backs coach, a wide receivers coach, and a tight ends coach. So why doesn’t the offensive line has its’ own coach?

Personally, I would love to see Jim Lachey or another former player take over the O-line, someone who could light a fire under these guys.

Yeah, that's the problem with the o-line dandy d. You're a frickin idiot. The only difference between you and Nut is that you don't have tressy's wanker in your mouth 24-7.

[Wolvrin704]

Why can't JT fire up his O-line? All we've ever heard from NUT is how great the O-line is and yet they underperformed last season.

[amazinblue]

Personally, I would love to see Jim Lachey or another former player take over the O-line, someone who could light a fire under these guys.

Bingo... Wouldn't you think that Tressel would realize this? Heck, a GA might be able to do the trick. Lachey would be a very good choice for the Buckeyes.

[rickyleach]

this is why don and nut are so full of ssshit , in 2008 22 returning starters from this team ,WITH THE NO.1 RATED HIGH SCHOOL PLAYER AT QB AND ATS ALL THEY COULD MUSTER IS 10 AND 3 AND NOW YOU CLAIM YOUR GOING TO BE BETTER IN 2009 , YOU GUYS ARE A JOKE , YOUR O LINE IS STILL FAT SLOW AND ARENT AS GREAT AS YOU THOUGHT AND YOUR D ESPECIAALY YOUR DBZ ARE LOUSY ,BUT YOU SIT THEIR AND SAY YOUR BETTER. 9 AND 4 IS ABOUT RIGHT FOR OSU ...

[Bossgobbler23]

I didn't realize how many Blue fans cross over the railroad tracks to the wrong side of town. This post got me laughing hard.

The truth on OSU is that Tressel is a good coach, not great. His teams are the same way. He can win playing the "Big Ten" football of old against the same, but has trouble with modern spread offenses from good teams. He will be left in the dust as most coaches eventually do because they can't change what has made them successful in the past. 4-5 star players only go so far and are limited by the system they are in. That is why Utah, Boise State, WV and the likes keep beating the crap out of much more talented 4-5 star player teams. This is why Michigan will take over. They will have great talent and a much superior offense. It will be like Tressel bringing a knife to the OK Corral.

[1OSUNUT]

RR had superior talent at West Virgina compared to the rest of the Big East - and did not run ruff shot over them. Teams will adapt to each other. Michigan will struggle and have tight games in the Big Ten under RR as well. Ohio State no matter how good they are has close games as well - it happens. If you think Michigan is just going to blow people out becuase they run the spread - your wrong. All I hear about is the offense - what about the defense ? The defense has been lousy for years. Even when he was at West Virgina RR did not have stellar defenses. Is every game going to be a shootout ?

Michigan will be good again - but the conference will get good with them. Many teams are running different forms of the spread and there will be a ton of film on Michigan. There is only so much you can do. It comes down to talent - and the Buckeyes and PSU have just as much or more then Michigan does. TP is going to give you fits for the next 3 years so don't expect to beat OSU till he is gone - maybe.

[rickyleach]

thats funny nut RICHROD and wv had top 5 dez his last 2 years at that school, but i guess thats not very good eh CAN YOU SAY NUT IS A JOKE

[The Michigan Man]

RR had superior talent at West Virgina compared to the rest of the Big East - and did not run ruff shot over them. Teams will adapt to each other. Michigan will struggle and have tight games in the Big Ten under RR as well. Ohio State no matter how good they are has close games as well - it happens. If you think Michigan is just going to blow people out becuase they run the spread - your wrong. All I hear about is the offense - what about the defense ? The defense has been lousy for years. Even when he was at West Virgina RR did not have stellar defenses. Is every game going to be a shootout ?

Michigan will be good again - but the conference will get good with them. Many teams are running different forms of the spread and there will be a ton of film on Michigan. There is only so much you can do. It comes down to talent - and the Buckeyes and PSU have just as much or more then Michigan does. TP is going to give you fits for the next 3 years so don't expect to beat OSU till he is gone - maybe.

Let’s take a look at some of WV's recruiting classes from RR's days:
(scout.com)

2002 WV - 33rd overall, 4th in the Big East
2003 WV - 57th overall, 5th in the Big East
2004 WV - 56th overall, 5th in the Big East
2005 WV - 33rd overall, 1st in the Big East (seniors playing this year)

If you analyze what each would do while juniors and seniors, you'll find the above classes of 1, 2, and 3* kids defeated top 10 talented programs like Georgia Tech, Georgia, and Oklahoma.

RR won the conference 4 out of 6 years - is that what you call being "figured out"?

If it all comes down to talent, how did a WV team with the 56th most talented recruiting class beat a top ten talented team like Oklahoma? Obviously there is a lot more to it than that.

As far as there being a "ton of film" on RR's teams, hasn't every single football game that's been played for the past 40-years been filmed? So what, everyone gets to look at everyone else's team, how is that an advantage to a particular team?

[Bossgobbler23]

RR had superior talent at West Virgina compared to the rest of the Big East - and did not run ruff shot over them. Teams will adapt to each other. Michigan will struggle and have tight games in the Big Ten under RR as well. Ohio State no matter how good they are has close games as well - it happens. If you think Michigan is just going to blow people out becuase they run the spread - your wrong. All I hear about is the offense - what about the defense ? The defense has been lousy for years. Even when he was at West Virgina RR did not have stellar defenses. Is every game going to be a shootout ?

Michigan will be good again - but the conference will get good with them. Many teams are running different forms of the spread and there will be a ton of film on Michigan. There is only so much you can do. It comes down to talent - and the Buckeyes and PSU have just as much or more then Michigan does. TP is going to give you fits for the next 3 years so don't expect to beat OSU till he is gone - maybe.

The Buckeyes also had film on Florida, LSU, USC, Illinios and Penn State. Most of these are teams that run spread or some form of it (USC is just TOUGH though OSU may have a chance this year due to a new QB at SC and a home game). OSU just plain and simple does not do well against spread teams. To stop a spread team you need very fast players on defense. As for not beating OSU until TP is gone??? We've beaten Heisman trophy winning QB's that could not only run but were light years ahead of TP in passing accuracy.

[1OSUNUT]

RR also got very lucky that 3 start recruits like Pat White and Steve Slayton were actully much better players then their ranking. He was able to ride their sucess to a lot of wins. He sort of caught lightning in a bottle for three years. Let's see how he does when he has to develope a QB. Based on last year - not real well.

[byebyelloyd]

RR also got very lucky that 3 start recruits like Pat White and Steve Slayton were actully much better players then their ranking. He was able to ride their sucess to a lot of wins. He sort of caught lightning in a bottle for three years. Let's see how he does when he has to develope a QB. Based on last year - not real well.

as opposed to ohio state developing who, lets see, fucking no sufficient QB in at least 3 decades, sorry pussy, your idiocy shines through again.

[byebyelloyd]

RR also got very lucky that 3 start recruits like Pat White and Steve Slayton were actully much better players then their ranking. He was able to ride their sucess to a lot of wins. He sort of caught lightning in a bottle for three years. Let's see how he does when he has to develope a QB. Based on last year - not real well.

its slaton dipshit pussy, and rodriguez recruited them because he knew they were good, not because of what a few useless journalist typed about a prospect they watched on some grainy film.

[byebyelloyd]

Let’s take a look at some of WV's recruiting classes from RR's days:
(scout.com)

2002 WV - 33rd overall, 4th in the Big East
2003 WV - 57th overall, 5th in the Big East
2004 WV - 56th overall, 5th in the Big East
2005 WV - 33rd overall, 1st in the Big East (seniors playing this year)

If you analyze what each would do while juniors and seniors, you'll find the above classes of 1, 2, and 3* kids defeated top 10 talented programs like Georgia Tech, Georgia, and Oklahoma.

RR won the conference 4 out of 6 years - is that what you call being "figured out"?

If it all comes down to talent, how did a WV team with the 56th most talented recruiting class beat a top ten talented team like Oklahoma? Obviously there is a lot more to it than that.

As far as there being a "ton of film" on RR's teams, hasn't every single football game that's been played for the past 40-years been filmed? So what, everyone gets to look at everyone else's team, how is that an advantage to a particular team?

lets not forget he has done something ohio state and tressel will NEVER DO, beat the SEC in a bowl game with all that "superior" 5th in the big east talent. 1nutsackpussy is the single most worthless football analyst i've ever seen and that includes the likes of dan fouts, everyone at ESPN, and all his pussy buddies on this site.

[1OSUNUT]

Troy Smith was not a great passer when he came to Columbus. In fact he was not even recruited as a QB. All he did was own you guys and win the Heisman. How many QB's have won the Hiesman at Michigan.

[byebyelloyd]

Troy Smith was not a great passer when he came to Columbus. In fact he was not even recruited as a QB. All he did was own you guys and win the Heisman. How many QB's have won the Hiesman at Michigan.

how many michigan QB's have been drafted into the nfl and started, hell 5-6 alone is more than ohio state will ever have, pussy. we were talking about developing QB's, something ohio state WILL NEVER BE ABLE TO DO and the great thing is, you know it and are too much of a little pussy to admit it.

[1OSUNUT]

How does their NFL sucess help Michigan ? All that says is that they were under coached while at Michigan. What pride do you take in that ?

Todd Boeckman was All-Big Ten two years ago - was he a great QB ? Servicable but not great.

Did Grbac, Brady, Henson or any of them even get mentioned for the Hiesman ? Let alone win it ? JT developed Smith into a great college QB.

[rickyleach]

NUTFUCKKK THE ONLY GIVEN IS no1 michigan beating ohio state and you taking in the aasss all year, your apathetic little turd, two mac school guys ranked higher then pryor TWO MAC SCHOOL GUYS RANKED HIGHER THEN PRYOR TWO MAC SCHOOL GUYS RANKED HIGHER THEN PRYOR, ranked 16 16 16 16 16 , ha ha ha ha ha

[Wolvrin704]

RR had superior talent at West Virgina compared to the rest of the Big East - and did not run ruff shot over them. Teams will adapt to each other. Michigan will struggle and have tight games in the Big Ten under RR as well. Ohio State no matter how good they are has close games as well - it happens. If you think Michigan is just going to blow people out becuase they run the spread - your wrong. All I hear about is the offense - what about the defense ? The defense has been lousy for years. Even when he was at West Virgina RR did not have stellar defenses. Is every game going to be a shootout ?

Michigan will be good again - but the conference will get good with them. Many teams are running different forms of the spread and there will be a ton of film on Michigan. There is only so much you can do. It comes down to talent - and the Buckeyes and PSU have just as much or more then Michigan does. TP is going to give you fits for the next 3 years so don't expect to beat OSU till he is gone - maybe.

Ok here you go saying UM will be good but the rest of the conference will b get good with them. In another thread I said the gap between OSU and the rest of the B10 was slimming and you guys basically said that as much as the rest of the league was getting better that OSU was getting that much better. Which way is it?

In life as one increases another decreases. So if UM gets better and the rest of the league does to then who decreases?

TP may give us fits but Tate will be giving OSU fits as well. Your team has been extremely vulnerable to spread QB's at Texas, PSU, Illinois, LSU and Florida. So how is it going to be any different with UM? Please explain this thoroughly. I'm not saying UM will become dominate again, but I sure don't see JT continuing this streak he's on for too many more years. And instead of worrying all the time about UM maybe you guys ought to worry about PSU as they seem to be doing well against OSU and always have.


Troy Smith was not a great passer when he came to Columbus. In fact he was not even recruited as a QB. All he did was own you guys and win the Heisman. How many QB's have won the Hiesman at Michigan.

Yet another example of your complete blindness. OSU can take a guy like Troy and turn him into a great player. But RR cannot take 3* guys and turn them into the same, then its a case of them being undervalued. Do you not see the hypocrisy?

Asking about Heisman QB's at UM.......how many DB's have won it at OSU? How many WR's?


How does their NFL sucess help Michigan ? All that says is that they were under coached while at Michigan. What pride do you take in that ?

Again you are saying exatly what many of us keep saying about Carr and the need for change. Yet you guys keep trying to tell us Carr was a great coach.